MN 125 proves you can hears sounds and walk while in first jhāna

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frank k
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MN 125 proves you can hears sounds and walk while in first jhāna

Post by frank k »

MN 125 first jhāna explicitly equated with (4sp) 4 sati-'paṭṭhāna
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Ceisiwr
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Re: MN 125 proves you can hears sounds and walk while in first jhāna

Post by Ceisiwr »

Frank, i genuinely mean this. I think you need to step back for a bit. Let it go for a time at least and perhaps focus on other things. There are lots of things to learn, discuss and debate in regards to the Dhamma and you don't have to keep showing how you think you are right all the time.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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samseva
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Re: MN 125 proves you can hears sounds and walk while in first jhāna

Post by samseva »

frankk wrote:Can you hear sounds while you're doing (4sp) 4 sati-'paṭṭhāna?
Can you walk, and do (4sp) 4 sati-'paṭṭhāna at the same time?
If you can walk and hear sounds in (4sp) 4 sati-'paṭṭhāna,
you can also walk and hear sounds while in first jhāna.
A is possible while B
C is possible while B
( If C and A are possible while B )
Therefore, A and C are possible while D

Entirely illogical, and a fallacy.
auto
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Re: MN 125 proves you can hears sounds and walk while in first jhāna

Post by auto »

Hearing the sound is concentration(with jhāna factors) on sensual object and is done for to make impression and transmit it to the next consciousness. Therefore rebirth consciousness is not accompanied with knowledge and thus one is unable to attain jhāna.
The sense-restraint is for to obtain the knowledge of jhāna that then the rebirth consciousness would be accompanied with the knowledge and then can attain jhāna.
also
rūpa produced by appanā-javana citta(jhāna) supports 4 postures,
abhidhamma 244 wrote: Of the 75 cittas, the 26 appanà-javana cittas not only
produce cittaja-råpa but also support the four bodily
postures – viz., standing, sitting, lying and walking.
but sensual javanas besides that also produces viññatti rupa for bodily and vocal actions,
wrote:The 32 cittas comprising mano-dvàràvajjana, 29
kàmàvacara javanas and 2 abhi¤¤às (supernormal
knowledge) produce cittaja-råpa, support the bodily
postures and also produce two vi¤¤atti-råpas for bodily
actions and vocal actions.

Of the 32 cittas mentioned above, the 13 somanassa
javanas also produce smiles and laughters whereas the
2 domanassa javanas, i.e., the 2 dosa-måla cittas, produce
moaning and weeping.
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