Jhāna and the Formless

[Ceisiwr]

I ask as I have been reading the Cūḷasuññata Sutta again, as I keep flipflopping on if the Jhānā are required to enter the formless attainments. I was recently of the view that the section on earth was a reference to the earth kasiṇa. However, now I am not so sure. In reading the the whole sutta the meditation actually begin with focusing on the concept (I choose this as the best translation of sañña) of the wilderness whilst also being aware of what said singular conceptual awareness is empty of. This seems to be a looser level of concentration than what we find with the Jhānā. It is not until we actually get to the signless, which is at the very end of the meditation, that we find the word samādhi. This suggests to me that the meditation outlined in the Cūḷasuññata Sutta is not an absorbed state, yet it is still a practice in the formless. This brings me to MN 105 & 106. In MN 105 we find the following:

• being intent on material things
• not being intent in material things, but intent on the imperturbable
• not on the imperturbable, but on base of nothingness
• not on base of nothingness, but on neither-conceptualisation-nor-non-conceptualisation
• not on neither-conceptualisation-nor-non-conceptualisation but on nibbāna.

No where in this sutta are the Jhānā mentioned. In MN 106 we find:

MN 106

ENTERING THE IMPERTURBABLE
1. A noble disciple reflects on this: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come; both of these are Māra’s sovereignty, Māra’s domain, and Māra’s territory. They conduce to bad, unskillful qualities such as desire, ill will, and aggression. And they create an obstacle for a noble disciple training here. Why don’t I meditate with an abundant, expansive heart, having mastered the world and stabilized the mind? Then I will have no more bad, unskillful qualities such as desire, ill will, and aggression. And by giving them up my mind, no longer limited, will become limitless and well developed.’
Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the imperturbable now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the imperturbable. This is said to be the first way of practice suitable for attaining the imperturbable.

2. Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come; whatever is form, all form is the four primary elements, or form derived from the four primary elements.’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the imperturbable now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the imperturbable. This is said to be the second way of practice suitable for attaining the imperturbable.

3. Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come, form in this life and in lives to come, concepts of forms in this life and in lives to come; all of these are impermanent. And what’s impermanent is not worth approving, welcoming, or clinging to.’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the imperturbable now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the imperturbable. This is said to be the third way of practice suitable for attaining the imperturbable.

ENTERING NOTHINGNESS
1. Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come, form in this life and in lives to come, concepts of forms in this life and in lives to come, and concepts of the imperturbable; all are concepts. Where they cease without anything left over, that is peaceful, that is sublime, namely the dimension of nothingness.’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the dimension of nothingness now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the dimension of nothingness. This is said to be the first way of practice suitable for attaining the dimension of nothingness.

2. Furthermore, a noble disciple has gone to a wilderness, or to the root of a tree, or to an empty hut, and reflects like this: ‘This is empty of a self or what belongs to a self.’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the dimension of nothingness now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the dimension of nothingness. This is said to be the second way of practice suitable for attaining the dimension of nothingness.

3. Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘I don’t belong to anyone anywhere! And nothing belongs to me anywhere!’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the dimension of nothingness now, or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the dimension of nothingness. This is said to be the third way of practice suitable for attaining the dimension of nothingness.

ENTERING NEITHER CONCEPTUALISATION-NOR-NON-CONCEPTUALISATION
Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come, form in this life and in lives to come, concepts of forms in this life and in lives to come, and concepts of the imperturbable, and concepts of the dimension of nothingness; all are concepts. Where they cease without anything left over, that is peaceful, that is sublime, namely the dimension of neither conceptualisation nor non- conceptualisation.’ Practicing in this way and meditating on it often their mind becomes confident in this dimension. Being confident, they either attain the dimension of neither conceptualisation nor non- conceptualisation now or are freed by wisdom. When their body breaks up, after death, it’s possible that the consciousness headed that way will be reborn in the dimension of neither conceptualisation nor non- conceptualisation. This is said to be the way of practice suitable for attaining the dimension of neither conceptualisation nor non- conceptualisation.”

The imperturbable (āneñja) is very often used as a reference to the formless attainments (from SuttaCentral):

āneñja neuter (& mfn.?)
- (n.) immovability; imperturbability.
- (mfn., or n. in apposition?) unmoved; not to be stirred; imperturbable (often applied both to determinative actions leading to existence in arūpāvacara spheres, and to arūpa jhāna stages) (see also aneñja)

Notice that there are 3 ways to enter the formless here. The 1st is via the limitless mind. In MN 127 this is defined as the 4 brahmavihārās. The 2nd way seems to be via the 4 element meditation, which matches the Cūḷasuññata Sutta. Notice that once again the Jhānā are not mentioned, nor samādhi. Still, it is possible that they require the Jhānā, however the 3rd way seems to be an entry into the formless via way of insight. Here it becomes difficult to see how there can be any Jhānā at all. In terms of the base of Nothingness we once again have 3 entries. The 1st one seems like it could apply to any ascetic, thus possibly being the route of entry for Āḷāra Kālāma. The 2nd way is uniquely Buddhist, and so looks like a route into said attainment that the Buddha discovered. The 3rd way uses the reflection "I don’t belong to anyone anywhere! And nothing belongs to me anywhere!’". This is either a unique entry of the Buddha, or possibly it is a form of the annihilationist doctrine similar to "I might not be, and it might not be mine. I will not be, and it will not be mine’". Interestingly this could shed some light on the meditative practices of the annihilationists. If they were attaining the base of Nothingness, it becomes easier to understand where their annihilationist theories came from. Support for this seems to come from Ven. Anālayo's findings:

DN 1 at DN I 37,1 and its parallels DĀ 21 at T I 93b20, T 21 at T I 269c22, a Tibetan discourse parallel in Weller 1934: 58,3 (§191), a discourse quotation in the *Śāriputrābhidharma, T 1548 at T XXVIII 660b24, and a discourse quotation in D 4094 ju 152a4 or Q 5595 tu 175a8. The same versions also attribute the arising of annihilationist views to the immaterial attainments (for Sanskrit fragments corresponding to the section on annihilationism see also Hartmann 1989: 54 and SHT X 4189, Wille 2008: 307).

https://www.buddhismuskunde.uni-hamburg ... o/ebms.pdf

Once again, in none of these is Jhāna said to be required nor samādhi, although possibly attaining the base of infinite space or consciousness first might be a requirement.

In short, it seems that perhaps there are other entries in the formless that do not require samādhi or Jhāna at all, possibly based on a looser form of concentration. These practices and attainments were, as we know, around before the Buddha. This could then perhaps explain how the Buddha could have practiced the formless with his former teachers without the Jhānā, and why it was only on the eve of his awakening that he remembered the Jhānā and thought of them as a method to awaken, with the formless being separate attainments that he still allowed some use for after his awakening.

I look forward to all replies



N.B. Interestingly in MN 106 we find this:

"Furthermore, a noble disciple reflects: ‘Sense objects in this life and in lives to come, sensual conceptions in this life and in lives to come, form in this life and in lives to come, concepts of forms in this life and in lives to come, and concepts of the imperturbable, and concepts of the dimension of nothingness; all are concepts (sabbā saññā)."

Perhaps this was the basis for Prajñaptivāda? Interesting thought.

[Ceisiwr]

Is there a sutta which explicitly states that Jhāna is a necessary condition for developing the formless attainments?

I recall there are suttas that refer to various non-Buddhist reflections/doctrines that lead to the sphere of nothingness (however, i can't find them; but i recall they include the doctrine of: "‘I might not be and it might not be mine; I shall not be, and it will not be mine"). Such spheres of nothingness may not be as refined as those reached via jhana.

I think you are referring to MN 106. See above.

[SteRo]

Is there a sutta which explicitly states that Jhāna is a necessary condition for developing the formless attainments?

No but there is a sutta which explicitly states that liberation coincides with the ability to enter the various rupa and arupa absorption in arbitrary sequence at will. This implicitly indicates that rupa jhana is not a necessary condition in terms of a fixed sequence for arupa jhana. However this does not exclude the mastery of rupa jhana principally being a necessary condition for arupa jhana.

[pitithefool]

To answer the original questions, no. I have not seen a sutta which explicitly states that the formless attainments must have jhana as a precedent.

I went into some more detail about this in the Samatha Bhavana "Jhana" post, but I think the most straightforward and pertinent scripture here is MN121. The descent into emptiness is shown here with no mention of jhana. I would think if jhana were absolutely necessary, it would have been mentioned in this sutta.

The most important aspect of the fourth jhana as it relates to the formless attainments is its stability. The formless attainments aren't very interesting to the mind the way that the jhanas are so it helps immensely to have the mind already at a point where it is unmoved by pleasure and pain.

When its in that sort of state, the perception of form can be dropped and the mind will actually stay there instead of breaking away and searching for pleasure.

[BrokenBones]

Is there a sutta which explicitly states that Jhāna is a necessary condition for developing the formless attainments?

No. And this helps make sense of the Buddha remembering jhana as a child under the rose-apple tree. That doesn't mean that the Buddha doesn't make use of the formless spheres or that they can't be approached through the four jhanas. The difference to my mind is that wisdom is required to achieve EBT jhanas and this wisdom would underlie the subsequent formless spheres. I believe that Formless spheres can be attained without prior jhana but are underscored with wrong view.

[Assaji]

Nope ajahn brahm ,ajahn sujato and ajahn analayo they are wrong they are very dangerous because they make people stray from the truth

Here is how dangerous visuddhimagga jhana that ajahn brahm and his disciples teach according to ajahn chah

Thank you for the great post!

[Assaji]

I ask as I have been reading the Cūḷasuññata Sutta again, as I keep flipflopping on if the Jhānā are required to enter the formless attainments. I was recently of the view that the section on earth was a reference to the earth kasiṇa. However, now I am not so sure.

Yes, it's a reference to the earth totality. Geoff Shatz writes about this in more detail:

http://web.archive.org/web/201603190519 ... asina.html

In reading the the whole sutta the meditation actually begin with focusing on the concept (I choose this as the best translation of sañña) of the wilderness whilst also being aware of what said singular conceptual awareness is empty of. This seems to be a looser level of concentration than what we find with the Jhānā.

In the modernist Buddhism, Jhāna is often understood as an absorbed state without any perception. However, there's plenty of evidence that in the Sutta Jhāna can be accompanied by perception.

As for the saññā, it is rather selective recognition: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2834

Alexander Wynne found some Brahmanical description of entering the formless attainments. Seems like it is possible to enter them without the four Jhānas.

[auto]

Maybe in the age when buddha has not arisen in the world, senses(or person who uses them) are so dull they don't discern anything(no dhamma), therefore satipatthana, developing existence till you see yourself in the dhamma(4th satipathana) for to come to know sabbe(all) dhamma(things) anatta(not self).

Idea of the above is that one got to discern pleasure or pain in the senses actually happening in the body. One starts with nothing, without making difference between mind and body. Namarupa nana in vipassana tradition is one of the first nanas, making difference what is body and what is mind and therefore know to concentrate accordingly to the insight.

[sphairos]

In ven. Analayo's Early Buddhist Meditation studies you will find a compelling analysis of the formless attainments on the pp. 150-163 and ff. He analyses Aneñjasappaya and other suttas, as well as the question of what Āḷāra Kālāma and Uddaka Rāmaputta practiced and how.

https://www.buddhismuskunde.uni-hamburg ... o/ebms.pdf

His view is that the formless attainments are developed on the basis of and after mastering the 4 jhānas. That's also how I always viewed this subject.

In his PhD on jhānas (Critical Analysis of Jhānas in Theravada Buddhist Meditation) bhante Gunaratana also skilfully demonstrates the same point (of course Bhante G's analysis is based on the Classical Theravāda views)

[pitithefool]

I ask as I have been reading the Cūḷasuññata Sutta again, as I keep flipflopping on if the Jhānā are required to enter the formless attainments. I was ...

Yes this is precisely right, but I'm telling you, it's better to have developed jhana prior.

Jhana + Arupa > Arupa without jhana

Again by doing this, you are running the gamut of experience, moving out of the sensual and into the form realm, then out of the form realm and into the formless. Having seem them all directly, one knows them, knows that they are conditioned, impermanent, suffering, not self and is able to abandon them. Having seen them, experienced them and abandoned them, he is unbound.

Developing the fourth jhana means dropping attachment to pleasure and pain and this is a great boon to one wishing to develop stability in the arupa
realms as they are not inherently pleasant, as the first through third jhanas are. The fourth serves as the perfect bridge between the form realms and the formless realms.

Also, think about what exactly is experienced in the jhanas versus the formless.

In the first jhana, you have vitakk-vicaras, piti-sukha and ekaggata, then in the second, there is only piti-sukha and ekaggata. In the third there is only equanimity and pleasure divested from piti. The fourth shows only purity of equanimity and mindfulness. The fourth is a single perception without piti-sukha or vitakka-vicara, so the only thing left to do from here would be to drop the perception of bounded form in order to enter into infinite space.

Likewise though, as MN121 and others point out, you can also enter the formless realms by practicing brahmavihara, or the four great elements, or the kasinas. The formless realms are so refined though, literally all of them just a singularity of perception until the singularity is dropped and finally perception itself.

Again though this will always go back to the stability factor as it's always better to have developed the mind to stillness before going into the formless attainments.

[pitithefool]

As a caveat, though it's good to remember that seeing the formless realms in whatever capacity are still direct, first hand experience of them even if they aren't uber-concentrated. Make what you will of that, but you should still be able to experience them and also experience disapassion towards them, even without jhana before hand. I may even goas far as recanting my earlier statement that the formless realms are necessary, but I choose to stick with my current view for safety's sake. It may very well be that the Buddha taught without the formless realms in certain circumstances but the nature of those circumstances is speculation for me at best.

It may be that the Buddha taught the formless realms to those already familiar with the four jhanas in order to experience the full gamut of becoming.

It may also be that the Buddha taught the jhanas to those with experience in the formless realms for the exact same reason.

It may further be that the Buddha taught both to those who were unfamiliar with meditation.

It may also be that the Buddha taught ways without jhana or formless attainments to those who were already familiar with both.

Again, this is all speculation but from what I see, the best thing to do is take use the most extensive description under the assumption that becoming is te be discerned in the sense realm, the form realm and the formless realm. Is it completely necessary to do all of this? I think so. I almost feel like some of the descriptions of enlightenment found in the canon are missing jhana or formless attainments because they were so common and it would not have been necessary to mention them to people already practicing a contemplative life, and if they were mentioned, it might have been to address gaps in knowledge or understanding to in the target audience.

Like I said though, just speculation

[Ceisiwr]

In ven. Analayo's Early Buddhist Meditation studies you will find a compelling analysis of the formless attainments on the pp. 150-163 and ff. He analyses Aneñjasappaya and other suttas, as well as the question of what Āḷāra Kālāma and Uddaka Rāmaputta practiced and how.

https://www.buddhismuskunde.uni-hamburg ... o/ebms.pdf

His view is that the formless attainments are developed on the basis of and after mastering the 4 jhānas. That's also how I always viewed this subject.

In his PhD on jhānas (Critical Analysis of Jhānas in Theravada Buddhist Meditation) bhante Gunaratana also skilfully demonstrates the same point (of course Bhante G's analysis is based on the Classical Theravāda views)

I've copied a comment of mine from the Jhāna thread:

On the fence on this one. There are arguments which support that view. Check out AN 8.63, which links the 4 brahmavihārās and the Jhānā into one overall mode of practice. In another sutta the brahmavihārās are said to culminate in the formless:

If he wishes: ‘May I dwell perceiving the repulsive in the unrepulsive and in the repulsive,’ he dwells perceiving the repulsive therein. If he wishes: ‘May I dwell perceiving the unrepulsive in the repulsive and in the unrepulsive,’ he dwells perceiving the unrepulsive therein. If he wishes: ‘Avoiding both the unrepulsive and the repulsive, may I dwell equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending,’ then he dwells therein equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending. Or else he enters and dwells in the deliverance of the beautiful. Bhikkhus, the liberation of mind by lovingkindness has the beautiful as its culmination, I say, for a wise bhikkhu here who has not penetrated to a superior liberation...

If he wishes: ‘May I dwell perceiving the repulsive in the unrepulsive,’ he dwells perceiving the repulsive therein…. If he wishes: ‘Avoiding both the unrepulsive and the repulsive, may I dwell equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending,’ then he dwells therein equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending. Or else, with the complete transcendence of perceptions of forms, with the passing away of perceptions of sensory impingement, with nonattention to perceptions of diversity, aware that ‘space is infinite,’ he enters and dwells in the base of the infinity of space. Bhikkhus, the liberation of mind by compassion has the base of the infinity of space as its culmination, I say, for a wise bhikkhu here who has not penetrated to a superior liberation...

If he wishes: ‘May I dwell perceiving the repulsive in the unrepulsive,’ he dwells perceiving the repulsive therein…. If he wishes: ‘Avoiding both the unrepulsive and the repulsive, may I dwell equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending, ’ then he dwells therein equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending. Or else, by completely transcending the base of the infinity of space, aware that ‘consciousness is infinite,’ he enters and dwells in the base of the infinity of consciousness. Bhikkhus, the liberation of mind by altruistic joy has the base of the infinity of consciousness as its culmination, I say, for a wise bhikkhu here who has not penetrated to a superior liberation...

If he wishes: ‘May I dwell perceiving the repulsive in the unrepulsive,’ he dwells perceiving the repulsive therein…. If he wishes: ‘Avoiding both the unrepulsive and the repulsive, may I dwell equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending,’ then he dwells therein equanimously, mindful and clearly comprehending. Or else, by completely transcending the base of the infinity of consciousness, aware that ‘there is nothing,’ he enters and dwells in the base of nothingness. Bhikkhus, the liberation of mind by equanimity has the base of nothingness as its culmination, I say, for a wise bhikkhu here who has not penetrated to a superior liberation.”

https://suttacentral.net/sn46.54/en/bodhi

SN 46.54 is quite a nice one since it weaves the the brahmavihārās, the Jhānā (although not explicitly stated, it does mention samādhi as part of the satta bojjhaṅgā) and the formless into one overall practice. This can bring us back to MN 106, which state that entry into the formless is either via the brahmavihārās, element meditation of some kind of insight into impermanence. Seeing as how the 1 entry into the formless (brahmavihārās) is tied to requiring the Jhānā as per the 2 suttas above, and seeing as how the 4 element practice seems to be a practice in the kasiṇa (and indeed infinite space & consciousness too), then it seems that possible mastery of the 4 Jhānā is required. This is further bolstered if we accept that the Jhānā consist of 1 conceptualisation and 1 conceptualisation only. If that is true, then the Jhānā must proceed the formless (since entry into them is via limiting oneself to 1 concept only, as per the kasiṇa). Still, a problem arises in that A) The Buddha recalled Jhānā from his youth, not from his time with Āḷāra Kālāma & Uddaka Rāmaputta and B) The Cūḷasuññata Sutta has a unitary conceptualisation of a forest etc, which is never explained as being a kasiṇa and it seems to have some measure of lose thought within each step.

Needless to say, it is an interesting topic. I'm still currently pretty wedded to the idea however that Āḷāra Kālāma & Uddaka Rāmaputta were annihilationists, that the Buddha began his career as one and that the formless are a valid option for liberation.

[pitithefool]

EEE I ALREADY REPLIED!!!