LaughingBannermen wrote: ↑Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:19 pm
I have otherwise gotten rather unempathetic "just be mindfully aware of it" as if ... as
psychologically easy to bear as more blameless forms of lust.
I think what they're trying to say is just subtly ignore said temptations and try to go with the flow of life. Which is OK, technically, but needs "more" to work, e.g. you'd need to channel all of that momentum and energy into something else, maybe something wholesome, like a hobby, some sort of activity that can "distract" you, "keep you busy", etc.
LaughingBannermen wrote: ↑Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:19 pmI have a problem with the Asubha meditation on principle, as it merely has us replace one cognitive distortion (lust) with another cognitive distortion (disgust).
To a degree, you're correct. Asubha contemplation is merely an attempt to explore and swtich from one perception to another. It won't solve problems completely. Even Ajahn Maha Boowa said it--the anagami isn't obsessed with contrived things such as disgust or repulsion from women, food, corpses, etc. But still, such contemplations are worthwhile for someone who is on the initial stages of the path. it's a valuable tool and skill, the ability to play with perception to suit your needs and interests. By suggesting it I'm not saying get obsessed with it or practice it formally. All I'm saying is give it a try. Think about the matter for some time, ponder it, consider how everything we find beautiful has very awful, gory aspects to it. Think about the 31 parts of the body, the 9 charnel ground contemplations, etc. Explore and play with perception in your day-to-day life.
Asubha should work at reducing some of the lust, so long as you don't get obsessed with it. Then, when it works, I'd suggest trying out even more subtler forms of playing with perception. For example, you could try contemplating and practicing non-multiplicity, non-objectification, etc. Basically, ponder on whether your sense of identity is real, on whether other beings are real, etc. Ponder whether concepts such as pleasure, pain, beauty, ugliness, form, beings, attractive, unttractive, etc., are real and 100% fact. With time you'll come to the conclusion that they're illusiory, products of perception, mere perceptions--they exist steadfast only when you insist on them, only when you objectify, only when you see a separation between "me" and "them", only when you pick between appealing and unappealing.
Then, ideally, at one point you'll be become dispassionate toward perceptions because of how pliable and unreliable they are; they'll be tiring and seem fake to you--and at that point you'll just drop them altogether once and for all; what you were taught, what you've heard, what you've assumed, etc., all of it. Then, unlike previously, you won't see anything tempting, yet you'll see. You won't see anything attractive or unattractive, yet you'll see. When you walk down the sidewalk, the pebbles on the ground would have equal value to you as the women walking beside you. You seeing an elderly woman that is as ugly as a corpse, or you seeing a beautiful young woman at the peak of her fertlity--it wouldn't matter to you, because at that point, in you, there won't be concepts such as "me", "them", "beings", "attractive", "unattractive", "female", "male", "old", "young", etc.
It's all about testing the limits of perception and then eventually ditching it altogether. As with asubha, you could also experiment with perceptions such as "everything is beautiful and pleasant", "there is nothing; nothingness", "everything is dead or dying", "everything is light", "everything is stressful", "everything is one", etc., whatever works for you and makes the most sense.
LaughingBannermen wrote: ↑Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:19 pmI would rather compromise my body through castration, than to compromise my mind in that way. In this way lust will be weakened to such an extent that I can use equanimity and disenchantment-with-pleasure without fear of being overwhelmed.
You're making assumptions based on what you think and or have heard. There is absolutely no guarantee.
I would be wary of compromising "your" body, whether through drugs or surgical interventions. These are not solutions, but cover-up attempts. Try to get at the root of the problem, the causes. Even if you do find a method to temporarily suspend these problems, instead of solving them, there's always the chance of them re-appearing again in the future, with the same or different (even worse) forms.
You've become obsessed with some perception, for one reason or another, perhaps unintentionally. No problem, now it's time to address the root--perception, objectification, classification, etc. No, there is no guarantee you'll succeed in these attempts to take back control, but you may as well try. And, also, meditation may or may not reveal more of these issues. Just like good medicine, it may very well sting and hurt--or it may not. Also, like I said previously, this is a multi-faceted issue and thus needs a multi-faceted solution; my brief summary here is not meant to be a fully fleshed out solution, it's just one of many advices.
Another thing, also--be wary of active, concentrative methods of meditation, as they may arouse the heat in you faster than other types of meditation, esp. if you're not practicing them properly, or if you don't practice celibacy and sense restraint on a deep, constant level. For example, I found
certain types of breath and energy-based meditation methods to be especially troubling when constantly dealing with high levels of dense lust.
What do you think, does any of this make sense? I don't know it all, but still. Refer back to my previous post for a summary on how I deal with stuff like this. Hope this helps.