celibacy tips

Buddhist ethical conduct including the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).
SteRo
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:41 am
SteRo wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:16 pm due to not getting laid or having an unusual lack of libido or due to unusual aversions.
The above is disgusting. Celibacy is practised to engage in non-harming; as the Buddha taught.
Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting. But these have just been mentioned as examples of celibacy outside of theravada practice because you have confused the topic of this thread which belongs to theravada practice with occurrences of celibacy in the world in general.

Of course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
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Re: celibacy tips

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SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 am
DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:41 am
SteRo wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:16 pm due to not getting laid or having an unusual lack of libido or due to unusual aversions.
The above is disgusting. Celibacy is practised to engage in non-harming; as the Buddha taught.
Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting. But these have just been mentioned as examples of celibacy outside of theravada practice because you have confused the topic of this thread which belongs to theravada practice with occurrences of celibacy in the world in general.

Of course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
what reason according to you?
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

confusedlayman wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:55 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 am
DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:41 am
The above is disgusting. Celibacy is practised to engage in non-harming; as the Buddha taught.
Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting. But these have just been mentioned as examples of celibacy outside of theravada practice because you have confused the topic of this thread which belongs to theravada practice with occurrences of celibacy in the world in general.

Of course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
what reason according to you?
Why should I speculate? There is a reason because there is a cause why monks practice celibacy and even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by confusedlayman »

SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:06 am
confusedlayman wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:55 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 am
Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting. But these have just been mentioned as examples of celibacy outside of theravada practice because you have confused the topic of this thread which belongs to theravada practice with occurrences of celibacy in the world in general.

Of course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
what reason according to you?
Why should I speculate? There is a reason because there is a cause why monks practice celibacy and even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
to avoid rebirth in sensual plane where we need to experience unnesaccary physical suffering of body
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

confusedlayman wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:07 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:06 am
confusedlayman wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:55 am

what reason according to you?
Why should I speculate? There is a reason because there is a cause why monks practice celibacy and even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
to avoid rebirth in sensual plane where we need to experience unnesaccary physical suffering of body
That doesn't seem to be the view of the majority of theravada laymen who don't want to practice celibacy. But anyway now we know what confusedlayman's conceptuality fabricates about the arising of intention to practice celibacy. Maybe it's the same, maybe it's different with other theravada laymen that want to practice celibacy ...? I don't know but what I know is that there are reasons.
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by Alino »

We don't live Samsara, Samsara is living us...

"Form, feelings, perceptions, formations, consciousness - don't care about us, we don't exist for them"
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by DooDoot »

SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 am Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting.
The impression you are giving is sex is an inherent necessity for laypeople. Do you live in a country were sex slavery & bisexuality are endemic due to compulsory military service & brutality?
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 amBut these have just been mentioned as examples of celibacy outside of theravada practice
Your posts on this forum show you don't know much about Theravada. Non-harming is not something unique to Theravada. Do you live in an apartheid colony where non-harming is not practised and regarded as something only reserved for special people, such as Theravadins?
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 ambecause you have confused the topic of this thread which belongs to theravada practice with occurrences of celibacy in the world in general.
No. It is you that is confused. You believe non-harming is not practised in the world. Do you live in a land that murdered, dispossessed and expelled local people; which is not regarded as immoral or harmful?
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 amOf course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
The above dichotomy is ridiculous. There are laymen that take 8 and 10 precepts. There are laymen who aspire for non-sensual happiness. The impression is because you personally and your student have no attained non-sensual bliss you personally have some sort of resentment towards Buddhist laymen who have attained non-sensual happiness; who are once-returners. :smile:
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:20 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 am Disgusting? :? I don't find incels or lack of libido or neurotic illnesses disgusting.
The impression you are giving is sex is an inherent necessity for laypeople.
:lol:

At least the fact that they continuously make it a topic might support that it's "an inherent necessity for laypeople". ;)
DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:20 am You believe non-harming is not practised in the world.
Never said so. But having sex does not necessarily coincide with causing harming.

DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:20 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:43 amOf course there is a reason why celibacy is practiced by monks but usually not by laymen in theravada. And there is a reason why even some theravada laymen want to practice celibacy.
... There are laymen that take 8 and 10 precepts. There are laymen who aspire for non-sensual happiness.
No contradiction to what I've said. That's great. May they attain all the happiness they are longing for.
Last edited by SteRo on Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by DooDoot »

SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:38 am But having sex does not necessarily coincide with causing harming.
wrong sex causes harm. that is why there are precepts in Theravada.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:41 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:38 am But having sex does not necessarily coincide with causing harming.
wrong sex causes harm. that is why there are precepts in Theravada.
And these precepts are obligatory? Obviously not. Why not if sex necessarily and always causes harm?
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by DooDoot »

SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:46 am And these precepts are obligatory?
They are for Buddhists for have taken refuge
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:46 am Why not if sex necessarily and always causes harm?
I never said sex "always" causes herm. Anyway, I previously said you sentiment was "disgusting". It appears to remain.

To end, those laymen who aspire to non-sensual happiness, which peaks with jhana, they practice celibacy, even when surrounded by beautiful women.

:ugeek:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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Re: celibacy tips

Post by SteRo »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:58 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:46 am And these precepts are obligatory?
They are for Buddhists for have taken refuge
All buddhist have to be celibate? That's new to me. And there are obviously many transgressors.
DooDoot wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:58 am
SteRo wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:46 am Why not if sex necessarily and always causes harm?
I never said sex "always" causes herm. Anyway, I previously said you sentiment was "disgusting". It appears to remain.

To end, those laymen who aspire to non-sensual happiness, which peaks with jhana, they practice celibacy, even when surrounded by beautiful women.
It would be inconsistent to aspire to non-sensual happiness but practicing celibacy only when surrounded by unattractive women or when women were absent.
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by Alino »

Necessities are to breath, to eat, closes, lodging, medicine... Its all we need to experience true happiness.
All the rest is superficial and not necessary.

There is no sensual engagement without dukkha that pressures our mind. There is no freedom from dukkha without sensual restraint and wisdom and stability of mind born from it.

Sensual pressure (as all mental fabrications) are just result of past kamma. It is a sort of algorithm that proposes you to buy products which you used to buy on the past. But we are free to gently say - "no thanks I dont need it any more". By dont buying sensual things, buy patiently enduring the "add" and dont buying it, we get free from future adds, and without add there is no dukkha of sensual pressure.

It is said that after Buddha's awakening Mara followed him for 7 years in order to see a breach and sell him stuff, but after seeing that Buddha will not buy anything, he left...
So going through the sensual river is a necessary work to do, we can't learn how to sweem from books or by talking about techniques, we need just to jump into the river and try to cross it over... through kammic streams, waves and dangers that can pull us back, but by going back into the river we will know the topology of our mind, we will know - there is an underground stream here, and there is coral reef, here are sharks, here are waves... so you start to know how to cross over your sensual stream and know all the dangers of it.
Nobody apart yourself will show us the path through our own mind, only by being courageous undertaking sensual restraint, and learning about the mind that we can cross it...

As Ajahn Jayasaro said : "only by sweeming against the stream that we can learn a lot about its force, direction, etc..." There is a lot of information, a lot of wisdom, that we can get from practicing 8 precepts and sweeming against our mind tendencies, and only this kind of wisdom can show us freedom.

How can we realise anicca, dukkha and anatta of our minds if we dont experiance them directly by patiently enduring mind's anicca, mind's dukkha, and mind's anatta? Impossible...

If someone is ok to living Samsara - it's good, he is not a bad or evil person, there is nothing evil in living Samsara, he kniwsrules and he enjoy the game - it's fine for him. But if someone wants to stop smoking and enjoy the happiness of breathing the fresh air, with no flavour or smoky odour, smokers shouldn't discourage him and saying him: "Good man! It's hard to stop smoking, why would you stop smoking and seek for a fresh air? Come with us, let's breathe smoke and dust together!"
We don't live Samsara, Samsara is living us...

"Form, feelings, perceptions, formations, consciousness - don't care about us, we don't exist for them"
auto
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by auto »

Celibacy is quite sad term. Use restraint instead, like continence. Ability to control bladder and bowels. The ability to control heat. Too much heat will cause the desire to go bad and it will be overwhelming, but the better you get controlling the heat you can absorb the heat and see the disappearance of the desire and this status quo is the fountain of pleasure.
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Re: celibacy tips

Post by bhooooo »

JamesTheGiant wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:17 am Don't torture yourself by trying for celibacy as a layperson.
it's only torture if you make it so!
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