Seed of dhamma corrupted?

On the cultivation of insight/wisdom
thepea
Posts: 4047
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: Seed of dhamma corrupted?

Post by thepea »

retrofuturist wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 8:26 am Greetings thepea,

If anything, it's more likely we'd merge some of your topics to prevent proliferation of overlapping topics throughout the forum.

But sankharas aside, it's clear that while Theravada Buddhism has the triple gem of the Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha... the Goenka equivalent is Goenka / U Ba Khin, Goenka's videos, and a pretty inconsistent pack of Assistant Teachers. I don't think it's a particularly solid foundation for the tradition, and in the absence of a successor to Goenka himself, I expect the tradition to deteriorate, rather than flourish. You may be witnessing the start of that with the things you describe.

If the Buddha predicted decline for his own dispensation, then what hope does Goenka have? How could it be otherwise?

Metta,
Paul. :)
I would prefer you don’t group my topics together.
Each one has a different aspect of the 8-fold noble path engrained in it. But is using current global circumstances as the backdrop for these discussions.
I realize everyday that I am not of similar mind as the majority of the population, although as this continues more and more are changing their view.
As few are sotapanna, this state of mind may very well be in the minority but does not make it unwise or not the correct view.

As far as Goenka centres deteriorating moving forward I share your view that this may be a possibility.
The dhamma instructions are very much in Mr.G’s audio and video discourses and how he guides one through the process. My experience in past was that the grounds and conditions were suitable for the dhamma to flourish.
But.....what I’m seeing currently with lack of open communication, teachers made unavailable to answer and be accountable for decisions resembles mara(government).
The organization globally is resembling a mighty corporation that wants to grow and consume and puts its own survival(dead entity) over that of the living.
As I said I am a purist, fancy meditation halls and newer clean sanitized kitchens mean nothing to me. You get your bowl, somebody puts something in it out of love and compassion and you take from that bowl what you need.
Then you work.

You can wrap a pretty shiny new meditation centre up in a fancy bow but if it is missing one aspect of dhamma it is going to fail.

I don’t know the future of Mr.G’s centres, I don’t require a teacher any more, only suitable accommodations that support the continuity of practice.
These centres provided me with this previously, they do not at the moment. They are currently very large retirement homes wasted on the few, being supported by the many.

I sense in your posts and in others over the years a real distain for this tradition. I have seen similar things in the monastic traditions, when training laity. Most monastic traditions lack the infrastructure to train laity. I do appreciate and respect Mr.G’s noble efforts to produce a global system that catered to laity. But he is gone and if corrupted in leadership this tradition will lose its purity from top down.

I hope you are wrong about this tradition, but at current it is failing my approval, I cannot recommend this tradition to any new students.
auto
Posts: 4582
Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:02 pm

Re: Seed of dhamma corrupted?

Post by auto »

thepea wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:24 pm
auto wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 4:57 pm yes, the kamma of those who were givers in the past won't use without accepting invitation.

Dhamma center may have initiative slogans like come do a 10 day retreat, but it is not meant for you specifically.

Its simply the quality of invitation, if there is no special effort that you are invited to accept then there is evil in it.
Are you saying that the man who came to the dhamma centre with two pockets full of quality soil to donate had a special invitation?
If you have been specially invited to the dhamma center, it doesn't count as invitation specially for you if it doesn't feel like it is for you.
An evil person overcommed by passions, if seeing something beautiful, will take it, because he feels it is for him.

Its not that hard to understand.
thepea
Posts: 4047
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: Seed of dhamma corrupted?

Post by thepea »

auto wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 3:14 pm
thepea wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:24 pm
auto wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 4:57 pm yes, the kamma of those who were givers in the past won't use without accepting invitation.

Dhamma center may have initiative slogans like come do a 10 day retreat, but it is not meant for you specifically.

Its simply the quality of invitation, if there is no special effort that you are invited to accept then there is evil in it.
Are you saying that the man who came to the dhamma centre with two pockets full of quality soil to donate had a special invitation?
If you have been specially invited to the dhamma center, it doesn't count as invitation specially for you if it doesn't feel like it is for you.
An evil person overcommed by passions, if seeing something beautiful, will take it, because he feels it is for him.

Its not that hard to understand.
I don’t stand under the dhamma centres. They are not authority of me. I as man with sweat of brow convert the forest into dhamma centre. Does this man require invitation?
On a mara(government) comprehension, we have owners of the land. But they are not owners of the land. Nobody owns land especially not land that was taken by force from another.
Alien.
So in the tradition of Buddha we visit the dhamma centre and we add to it, not take away from it.
This is what a dhamma centre is, open doors.
No locks or keys, no guards at the door.
The men and women of dhamma come and give Dana and service to keep the centre functional and in good order.
This is best served by those radiating loving kindness drenched in dhamma, not private contractors working to take a few coins from the centre.
Who sends out the invitation?
The man or woman in need of dhamma seeks out the centre, correct?
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