Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

A forum for Dhamma resources in languages other than English
User avatar
Eko Care
Posts: 300
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:13 am

Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Eko Care »

I have encountered many warnings circulating as below about this PureDhamma website, Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero, Dharmayai Obai, Walasmulle abhaya Thero ..etc by many Sri Lankans. I have no time to read about it and investigate everything, but it seems like a serious matter.
Warning to Sinhala Buddhists residing in Australia ... !!!

Walasmulla Abhaya, a former novice monk who had for a long time promoted the iniquity of Vaharakaism throughout the country under the program called Absoluteness, was recently expelled from the Sasana by the Shyamopali Vanawasa Sangha Sabha.

The main reason for such disciplinary expulsion from the Sasana was to mislead those who sought Nirvana through the Dhamma of the Blessed Ones and to distort and propagate the Dhamma of the Tripitaka, which contains the pure Dhamma of the Blessed Ones. That is, the text containing the Pali words was distorted and given distorted interpretations. The text was distorted as it was thought, making the little letters great and the great letters small. Three-dimensional mutation plays a major role in this.

In addition to this, the great Buddhism was denigrated by the fact that as the Samma Samadhi increased, the belly light would go on at the meditative levels and that the only method of meditation called belly light was with him and that it was the true Aryan path. Many were celebrated in Aryan parables.

Another dangerous aspect of this distortion was the socialization of the false notion that religion does not require discipline and that without it virtue, concentration and wisdom can be obtained.

The decision was taken by the Sangha Council after pointing out the objections and facts of many Dharma devotees regarding the distortion carried out in various ways. Even after his expulsion from the Sasana, the former Samanera Bhikkhu blamed the Mahanayake Thero.

Although he has now lost his priesthood, he has begun to deceive people with a new face. That is to say, to popularize a program called "The Beginning of the End of a Journey" with a new title, which has an end to hell as before. In this way, many people fall prey to unrighteousness and end up in hell, the abyss of misery.

Ironically, the Tripitaka, which contains the Dhamma, has become a national heritage, adding a few new words to the propaganda of the Dharma program. That is to say, this new program consists of the pure Dhamma itself using about 300 formulas of the Tripitaka Dhamma. There is a popular saying in our society that the tiger's paws do not change even if it moves in the jungle. This is also the case. That is to say, by socializing the meditation of the previous distortion, the belly light, and propagating that they were formulated according to the formulas in accordance with the Tripitaka Dhamma.

The Trinitarian Maha Sangha should be on the lookout for the possibility of distorting local and foreign Buddhists and claiming that it is the correct language of the Buddha, even at a time when the pure and pure Tripitaka Dhamma has a legal basis as a national heritage. What is the Sasana right of a person who is no longer a name of the Lord in the country and abroad as a heretic, a perversion of the text, a pure religion? What is legal?

The Trincomalee High Priests should be particularly aware of the basis on which this person can obtain a visa for religious purposes in order to propagate such iniquity. Must be vigilant.

The man, who is still shamelessly involved in the heresy, recently arrived in Australia for a series of propaganda campaigns called "The Beginning of the End of a Journey". He is no longer a monk and is carrying out programs to deceive the people and take them to hell and with the help of NGO gangs he is rapidly destroying the Buddha Sasana.

Before you and your friends get caught up in this fraudulent person, be aware of it and let others know and avoid falling into hellish heresy!

Bless the Triple Gem !!!
Shrawaka
More criticisms:
SuttaCentral:
“Distracted Buddhist Community”
Unorthodox renderings of anatta
Bhava and jati, puredhamma
Reddit:
On the website puredhamma.net, the Buddha's teachings are interpreted in quite different ways from "mainstream" theravada. Which arguments do other theravada buddhists use to reject these interpretations?
Dhammawheel:
"Pure Dhamma" or "Pure Adhamma"?
Quora:
Is puredhamma.net legit?
https://impuredhamma.ext.trekmentor.com/about-him
Do you think you know better than the ancient Sangha ?
classicaltheravada.wordpress.com
User avatar
Sam Vara
Posts: 8126
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:42 pm
Location: Sussex, U.K.

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Sam Vara »

Eko Care wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:15 pm I have encountered many warnings circulating as below about this PureDhamma website, Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero, Dharmayai Obai, Walasmulle abhaya Thero ..etc by many Sri Lankans. I have no time to read about it and investigate everything, but it seems like a serious matter.
You can check this out here on DW. In "Connections to Other Paths", new material offered regularly by Lal.
User avatar
mikenz66
Posts: 18421
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:37 am
Location: Aotearoa, New Zealand

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by mikenz66 »

Here is the thread that Sam Vara refers to: viewtopic.php?f=46&t=26749

Here is Ven Dhammanando's critique: viewtopic.php?p=421520#p421520

:heart:
Mike
User avatar
Eko Care
Posts: 300
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:13 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Eko Care »

Bhikkhu Pesala wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:48 pm
Dhammanando wrote:Conclusion

The Pure Dhamma website offers a variety of revisionist readings of the Pali Suttas based upon the site-owner’s (or his guru’s) claimed re-discovery of supposed hidden meanings of key Pali terms.

These proposed hidden meanings, when not presented merely as bald assertions, are defended by resort to Pali philological analysis. But since the site-owner is demonstrably incompetent in both Indic philology in general and Pali in particular his arguments are undeserving of credence. Rather than leading to the true understanding of the Dhamma via the revelation of higher (but long-concealed) meanings, they lead only to baloney.
Spot-on (as long as by "baloney" you don't mean "Large smooth-textured smoked sausage of beef and veal and pork.") With that, I will bow out of any further discussion about pure dhamma.net It is just a net of views, a trap for the unwary, and it is too time-consuming to correct every error.

I hope the authors will listen to the two of us and take down this website until they are more qualified to write something that is truly helpful to revive the true Dhamma.
Somewhat understood.
Do you think you know better than the ancient Sangha ?
classicaltheravada.wordpress.com
Dan74
Posts: 3829
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:12 pm
Location: Switzerland

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Dan74 »

Eko Care wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:56 pm
Bhikkhu Pesala wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:48 pm
Dhammanando wrote:Conclusion

The Pure Dhamma website offers a variety of revisionist readings of the Pali Suttas based upon the site-owner’s (or his guru’s) claimed re-discovery of supposed hidden meanings of key Pali terms.

These proposed hidden meanings, when not presented merely as bald assertions, are defended by resort to Pali philological analysis. But since the site-owner is demonstrably incompetent in both Indic philology in general and Pali in particular his arguments are undeserving of credence. Rather than leading to the true understanding of the Dhamma via the revelation of higher (but long-concealed) meanings, they lead only to baloney.
Spot-on (as long as by "baloney" you don't mean "Large smooth-textured smoked sausage of beef and veal and pork.") With that, I will bow out of any further discussion about pure dhamma.net It is just a net of views, a trap for the unwary, and it is too time-consuming to correct every error.

I hope the authors will listen to the two of us and take down this website until they are more qualified to write something that is truly helpful to revive the true Dhamma.
Somewhat understood.
Translation: they make stuff up.
_/|\_
SarathW
Posts: 15676
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by SarathW »

The author of this website is a member of the Dahamma Wheel and regularly updates the thread.
The problem is he never participates in discussions.
We exactly can't understand his views in a discussion format.
He has designed his website very methodically, if he is willing to participate in criticisms he can make that website more valuable.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
SarathW
Posts: 15676
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by SarathW »

Does any person know how Ven Abayaratnalakara came up with his teaching?
Did he make up all of them or he also had another teacher?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 6138
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Mae Wang Huai Rin, Li District, Lamphun

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Dhammanando »

SarathW wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:52 pm The author of this website is a member of the Dahamma Wheel and regularly updates the thread.
The problem is he never participates in discussions.
Actually Lal does engage with those who post to his thread. It's just that most members who do so quickly conclude that the game isn't worth the candle.
Anabhirati kho, āvuso, imasmiṃ dhammavinaye dukkhā, abhirati sukhā.

“To not delight in this dhammavinaya, friend, is painful; to delight in it is bliss.”
(Sukhasutta, AN 10:66)
Lal
Posts: 586
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 11:39 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Lal »

Actually Lal does engage with those who post to his thread. It's just that most members who do so quickly conclude that the game isn't worth the candle.
How about the following that I posted in the other thread today? Does it "hold water"?

Without getting into too many issues, we can just take one concept to see whose views are not correct.
- Sutta Central (and many other websites) still translate viññāṇa as just "consciousness."
- I have discussed in detail why this is wrong. There are TWO types of viññāṇa: vipaka vinnana and kamma viññāṇa (generated via abhisankhara).

1. Anulōma and patilōma Paticca Samuppāda describe the forward progression of events leading to eventual suffering and going back to see that indeed avijjā must be removed (by cultivating wisdom or paññā) in order to stop future suffering from arising.

- "Paṭha­ma­ Bodhi Sutta (Udāna 1.1)":https://suttacentral.net/ud1.1/pli/ms and "Dutiya ­Bodhi Sutta (Udāna 1.2)":https://suttacentral.net/ud1.2/pli/ms state how the Buddha comprehended anulōma and patilōma Paticca Samuppāda during the night of the Enlightenment.
- Most people are quite familiar with how suffering originates with saṅ­khā­ra generation due to the ignorance of the Four Noble Truths (avijjā), and then goes through the familiar steps: "avijjā paccayā saṅkhārā, saṅ­khā­ra ­pac­cayā viññāṇaṃ,..and ends with ".. Evametassa kevalassa duk­khak­khan­dhassa samudayo hotī”ti OR "the whole mass of suffering".

2. It is also important to trace the steps backwards and see how future suffering can be stopped by cultivating paññā and "avijjā nirodhā saṅ­khā­ra­nirodho, saṅ­khā­ra ­nirodhā viññāṇa nirodho, viññāṇa nirodhā nāmarūpa ­nirodho, nāmarūpa­ nirodhā saḷāya­tana ­nirodho, saḷāya­tana­ nirodhā phassa nirodho, phassa nirodhā vedanā nirodho, vedanā nirodhā taṇhānirodho, taṇhā nirodhā upādāna nirodho, upādāna nirodhā bhava nirodho, bhava nirodhā jāti nirodho, jāti nirodhā jarāmaraṇaṃ soka­pari­deva­duk­kha­do­manas­supāyāsā nirujjhanti. Evametassa kevalassa duk­khak­khan­dhassa nirodho hotī'ti".
- The English translation at Sutta Central states: "When ignorance ceases, choices cease. When choices cease, consciousness ceases."
- See https://suttacentral.net/ud1.2/en/sujato

One who has attained Nibbana must have removed only "kamma viññāṇa", but still would have vipaka viññāṇa (i.e., seeing, hearing, etc).
But Sutta Central and other English websites do not make this distinction, simply because they DO NOT understand that there are two types of vinnana.
- Wasn't the Buddha able to see, hear, etc after attaining the Buddhahood? So, he had cakkhu viññāṇa, sota viññāṇa, etc fully functional.
- But he stopped generating "kamma viññāṇa" with the akusala-mula Paticca Samuppada: "avijjā paccayā saṅkhārā, saṅ­khā­ra ­pac­cayā viññāṇaṃ,
- When are those WRONG translations are going to be corrected?

Instead of making false accusations (and unproven statements), one should be able to discuss real issues about concepts.
User avatar
Eko Care
Posts: 300
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:13 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Eko Care »

SarathW wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:24 pm Does any person know how Ven Abayaratnalakara came up with his teaching?
Did he make up all of them or he also had another teacher?
Sam Vara wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:26 pm
mikenz66 wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:47 pm
Dan74 wrote: Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:17 pm
Dhammanando wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 4:37 pm
I got some information, but there may be more,
  • Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara and Meevanapalane Saddhammalankara were said to be lay friends who worked in archeological department and aslo involved in coconut business or something like that.
  • Ven. Waharaka had continued a "fortune telling/ mind reading/ black magic" sort of practice even as a layman.
  • They seemed like influenced by a book/books written by one/some of old colonial British person/people which argues the Blessed One was born in Sri Lanka and the British robbed old genuine commentaries and kept them in England museums.
  • That book or these two monks then argued "the root language is not Pali but Sinhalese", since the Blessed One was born in Sri Lanka.
    Then they started to give new definitions for Pali words using Sinhala roots. (ridiculously even for some of English words).
  • Further, they started to discover (so called) original Buddhist pilgrim sites in Sri lanka, by the village name analysis using sinhala language roots.
    Then they developed a map of Jambudipa which is Srilanka, according to them.
  • Afterwards some of the modern-educated people attracted by them and started to propagate their views
  • Few of the poor temples which were considered as discovered pilgrim sites, had not been opposed to them, because of the donations they received by this new crowd of pilgrims.
  • Then Ven Walasmulle Abhaya had joined this group, and started to preach the same in a bit different way.
  • Two of them got expelled from the villages where they resided. Then they had to build new temples in new places.
  • Later they were expelled by the Nikaya Head Monks and the Ministry of Buddhasasana.
  • Then they tried to Print the Tipitaka with new definitions, by being friendly with the head monks of Buddhist Cultural Center Printing Press.
  • After that, some other monk groups started holding Aditthana Pujas at various sacred places, concerning the protection of the Buddhism, and held conferences regarding the issue.
  • Then the President had to make the Tipitaka a National Heritage in order to protect it from them.
Any more information ....
Do you think you know better than the ancient Sangha ?
classicaltheravada.wordpress.com
User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 6138
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Mae Wang Huai Rin, Li District, Lamphun

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Dhammanando »

Lal wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:48 pm But Sutta Central and other English websites do not make this distinction, simply because they DO NOT understand that there are two types of vinnana.
In the phrase saṅ­khā­ra ­nirodhā viññāṇa nirodho neither the word "kamma" nor the word "vipāka" appears.

So what your complaint seems to boil down to is that neither Ven. Ānandajoti nor Ven. Sujāto have provided expansive (or explanatory) translations that would be in line with your understanding of dependent arising. This could mean either that they don't wish to provide an explanatory translation of any sort but only a form-equivalent one (one that translates only the words that are actually there), or, that their understanding of dependent arising happens to be different from yours, or both. As such, their renderings will be at fault only if the Waharakaist interpretation of dependent arising is the correct one and all its competitors are in error. I strongly doubt that either of the two monks would accept this.
Anabhirati kho, āvuso, imasmiṃ dhammavinaye dukkhā, abhirati sukhā.

“To not delight in this dhammavinaya, friend, is painful; to delight in it is bliss.”
(Sukhasutta, AN 10:66)
User avatar
Eko Care
Posts: 300
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:13 am

Re: Pure dhamma .net Warning !!!

Post by Eko Care »

Dhammanando wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:44 pm
Lal wrote:
But Sutta Central and other English websites ... DO NOT understand ...
.. I strongly doubt that either of the two monks would accept this.
I heard(youtube) from the head monk of Na Uyana monastery Sri lanka saying:
"Even the British Indian courts (which have zero faith) accepted that "The Buddha born in India" during the court case filed by Anagarika Dharmapala in 19th century."
"More over, all the historians and archeologists clearly accept it."
"There are many evidences that can even be seen by our own eyes"

"These people(who says the Buddha born in Sri lanka) doesn't have brain at least up to the basic level"
"let alone their new theories"
Last edited by Eko Care on Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Do you think you know better than the ancient Sangha ?
classicaltheravada.wordpress.com
Lal
Posts: 586
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 11:39 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Lal »

This has NOTHING to do with a particular interpretation of Paticca Samuppada (Dependent Arising).

My point is that “saṅkhāra nirodhā viññāṇa nirodho” SHOULD NOT be literally translated as “When choices cease, consciousness ceases."

It is quite clear from discussions at Dhamma Wheel that most people are still confused about this.
- I have seen many people asking questions about whether an Arahant loses consciousness after attaining Nibbana.

By the way, “choices” does not convey the meaning of “sankhara” either.
- It is a mess that these translators have created!
- Suttas are translated mindlessly “word-by-word” without any regard to teaching Buddha Dhamma.
In any case, it seems that enough people are reading my posts. Hopefully, things will become clear as they learn the correct Dhamma.
User avatar
Ceisiwr
Posts: 12036
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:36 am
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by Ceisiwr »

Lal wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:11 pm
“When choices cease, consciousness ceases."
That is quite literally what it says. A lot of confusion around as to why the Arahant goes on living has to do with viewing dependent origination in terms of causality rather than conditionality. Since it refers to necessary but not sufficient reasons, there can be a time delay between cessations. It’s rather obvious that birth does not cause death, but is rather a necessary condition for it.
Hopefully, things will become clear as they learn the correct Dhamma.
This isn’t really impressive. Tons of people make this claim, all of them contradictory.
“When serenity is developed, what purpose does it serve? The mind is developed. And when the mind is developed, what purpose does it serve? Lust is abandoned.”

“When insight is developed, what purpose does it serve? Wisdom is developed. And when wisdom is developed, what purpose does it serve? Ignorance is abandoned."


AN 2.31
SarathW
Posts: 15676
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Puredhamma.net Warning !!!

Post by SarathW »

Lal wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:48 pm
Actually Lal does engage with those who post to his thread. It's just that most members who do so quickly conclude that the game isn't worth the candle.
How about the following that I posted in the other thread today? Does it "hold water"?

Without getting into too many issues, we can just take one concept to see whose views are not correct.
- Sutta Central (and many other websites) still translate viññāṇa as just "consciousness."
- I have discussed in detail why this is wrong. There are TWO types of viññāṇa: vipaka vinnana and kamma viññāṇa (generated via abhisankhara).

1. Anulōma and patilōma Paticca Samuppāda describe the forward progression of events leading to eventual suffering and going back to see that indeed avijjā must be removed (by cultivating wisdom or paññā) in order to stop future suffering from arising.

- "Paṭha­ma­ Bodhi Sutta (Udāna 1.1)":https://suttacentral.net/ud1.1/pli/ms and "Dutiya ­Bodhi Sutta (Udāna 1.2)":https://suttacentral.net/ud1.2/pli/ms state how the Buddha comprehended anulōma and patilōma Paticca Samuppāda during the night of the Enlightenment.
- Most people are quite familiar with how suffering originates with saṅ­khā­ra generation due to the ignorance of the Four Noble Truths (avijjā), and then goes through the familiar steps: "avijjā paccayā saṅkhārā, saṅ­khā­ra ­pac­cayā viññāṇaṃ,..and ends with ".. Evametassa kevalassa duk­khak­khan­dhassa samudayo hotī”ti OR "the whole mass of suffering".

2. It is also important to trace the steps backwards and see how future suffering can be stopped by cultivating paññā and "avijjā nirodhā saṅ­khā­ra­nirodho, saṅ­khā­ra ­nirodhā viññāṇa nirodho, viññāṇa nirodhā nāmarūpa ­nirodho, nāmarūpa­ nirodhā saḷāya­tana ­nirodho, saḷāya­tana­ nirodhā phassa nirodho, phassa nirodhā vedanā nirodho, vedanā nirodhā taṇhānirodho, taṇhā nirodhā upādāna nirodho, upādāna nirodhā bhava nirodho, bhava nirodhā jāti nirodho, jāti nirodhā jarāmaraṇaṃ soka­pari­deva­duk­kha­do­manas­supāyāsā nirujjhanti. Evametassa kevalassa duk­khak­khan­dhassa nirodho hotī'ti".
- The English translation at Sutta Central states: "When ignorance ceases, choices cease. When choices cease, consciousness ceases."
- See https://suttacentral.net/ud1.2/en/sujato

One who has attained Nibbana must have removed only "kamma viññāṇa", but still would have vipaka viññāṇa (i.e., seeing, hearing, etc).
But Sutta Central and other English websites do not make this distinction, simply because they DO NOT understand that there are two types of vinnana.
- Wasn't the Buddha able to see, hear, etc after attaining the Buddhahood? So, he had cakkhu viññāṇa, sota viññāṇa, etc fully functional.
- But he stopped generating "kamma viññāṇa" with the akusala-mula Paticca Samuppada: "avijjā paccayā saṅkhārā, saṅ­khā­ra ­pac­cayā viññāṇaṃ,
- When are those WRONG translations are going to be corrected?

Instead of making false accusations (and unproven statements), one should be able to discuss real issues about concepts.
Hi Lal as far as I know I have no objection to your post.
Vinnana in Dependent origination is "Patisandhi Vinnana"
So consciousness means "rebirth consciousness"
This is no different from the usage Samadhi means "Samma Samadhi"
There is a Sutta to support this.
It is just a translation issue but not an issue about the teaching.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Post Reply