Greetings,
For those advocating the intentional act of making the breath coarse, I bring your attention to Vism VIII.168
Sections 4-9 are of most significance.
“How, breathing in long, does he know: ‘I breathe in long,’ breathing out
long, does he know: ‘I breathe out long?’ (1) He breathes in a long in-breath
reckoned as an extent. (2) He breathes out a long out-breath reckoned as an
extent. (3) He breathes in and breathes out long in-breaths and out-breaths
reckoned as an extent. As he breathes in and breathes out long in-breaths and
out-breaths reckoned as an extent, zeal arises. (4) Through zeal he breathes in
a long in-breath more subtle than before reckoned as an extent. (5) Through zeal
he breathes out a long out-breath more subtle than before reckoned as an extent.
(6) Through zeal he breathes in and breathes out long in-breaths and out-breaths
more subtle than before reckoned as an extent. As, through zeal, he breathes in
and breathes out long in-breaths and out-breaths more subtle than before
reckoned as an extent, gladness arises. (7) Through gladness he breathes
in a long in-breath more subtle than before reckoned as an extent. (8) Through
gladness he breathes out a long out-breath more subtle than before reckoned as
an extent. (9) Through gladness he breathes in and breathes out long in-breaths
and out-breaths more subtle than before reckoned as an extent. As, through
gladness, he breathes in and breathes out long in-breaths and out-breaths more
subtle than before reckoned as an extent, his mind turns away from the long inbreaths
and out-breaths and equanimity is established.
Similarly, in the suttas there is frequent mention of the act of tranquilizing the bodily formation...
SN 54.10 wrote:He trains thus: 'Tranquilizing the bodily formation, I will breathe in';
He trains thus: 'Tranquilizing the bodily formation, I will breathe out';..."
Not once have I seen an instruction in the sutta or commentary which advises the meditator to inflame or aggravate the bodily formation with the breath. Have you?
Perhaps an advocate for such folly can point us in the direction of any scriptural support for this position? I would be incredibly interested to see something... anything...?
The only possible instance I can think of is one where the meditator who is on the verge of falling asleep is given a series of possible options by which to keep themselves awake... (
AN 7.58) ... but even it does not recommend coarse breathing.
Javi wrote:As has been said before in this thread (and others), the suttas say nothing about controlling the breath.
Yet they do speak of tranquillizing the bodily formation with the breath, and a preference for subtle breath over coarse breath... or are you denying the existence of such sutta instruction? Is there any doctrinal support for your position or is your opposition rooted instead in faith and conjecture?
Metta,
Paul.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."