Child Lama. I think it is ridiculous.

[Grigoris]

Isn't it incredible how the least informed always have the strongest opinions? Never ceases to amaze me!

And the saddest bit is that their ignorance does not stretch only to other traditions, but to their own too!

It is truly sad.

[Lucas Oliveira]

Isn't it incredible how the least informed always have the strongest opinions? Never ceases to amaze me!

And the saddest bit is that their ignorance does not stretch only to other traditions, but to their own too!

It is truly sad.

Welcome Grigoris!

[mikenz66]

That's Buddhism.
The rest is not.
Period.
.

No, that's your definition. Please abide by the rules of the forum.

Reasoned criticism is fine. Throwing around insults is not.


Mike

[Grigoris]

Not having an intelligent or logical response to the points being made, the ignorant turn immediately to sectarianism, blissfully unaware of the fact that it is not traditions but sectarian posturing that lead to schisms.

[retrofuturist]

Greetings,

Not having an intelligent or logical response to the points being made, the ignorant turn immediately to sectarianism, blissfully unaware of the fact that it is not traditions but sectarian posturing that lead to schisms.

OK, that's enough meta-discussion, thank you.



Metta,
Paul.

[ToVincent]

... It is not traditions but sectarian posturing that lead to schisms.

.

Not at all.
It is adding to the original message that leads to schism.
Like this Bon's reincarnated child lama stuff.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Bon-Tibetan-religion
.
If refferring to the Encyclopedia Britannica is a lack of logical or intelligent response; then what can be ?
.
.

[Grigoris]

Not at all.
It is adding to the original message that leads to schism.
Like this Bon's reincarnated child lama stuff.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Bon-Tibetan-religion
.
If refferring to the Encyclopedia Britannica is a lack of logical or intelligent response; then what can be ?
.
.

The article you link to is a piece of rubbish (to put it lightly), it adds nothing intelligent to the discussion.

If you actually want to learn about Bon, in order to have an intelligent and informed opinion, I recommend you start off with something REALLY simple like the wikipedia page on Bon.

If you want to get adventurous I thoroughly recommend Norbu, Namkhai 1995. Drung, Deu and Bön: Narrations, Symbolic languages and the Bön tradition in ancient Tibet. Namkhai Norbu is an amazing BUDDIST Dzogchen teacher and a scholar with a professorship at Naples University, Italy.

If you want something lighter then you can try Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche (2002), Healing with Form, Energy, and Light. Ithaca, New York: Snow Lion Publications.

I know you won't, but other people reading this thread, actually interested in learning something, will hopefully benefit from my time and energy.

[Grigoris]

And this attempt to purposefully confound Vajrayana Buddhism with Bon...

Bon regents persecuted Tibetan Buddhism (and vice versa) Bon was only accepted as a school of Tibetan Buddhism under the current Dalai Lama. Many Vajrayana Buddhist teachers are still highly suspect of the legitimacy of Bon as a Buddhist tradition. Vajrayana practices came directly from Indian Buddhist teachers, yes there were some practices co-opted from the Bon but they are practiced from a strictly Buddhist view. If you were to take offence at something Tibetan in origin it should be with the Jonangpa tradition. But even they were heavily persecuted by the Gelug hierarchy. Their monasteries were attacked, followers were killed and monastics were forcibly converted. Again: it is only under the current Dalai Lama that they have been recognised as a Buddhist tradition.

[alan]

So. I've learned at least one thing from this: There is such a thing called called Bon.
But, I don't care. Because it seems to be completely ridiculous.
Just like the idea that there could be a child lama.

There could not be a Child Lama, right?
In the Suttas, nothing like that was ever said.

[DNS]

There could not be a Child Lama, right?
In the Suttas, nothing like that was ever said.

In Theravada, there is no tulku system where elder monks seek out the rebirth of a famous or semi-famous monk. During the time of the Buddha there were a few very young monks who attained enlightenment. One of them was Sopaka who was only 7 years old, but that was very rare.

[alan]

Never heard of that one. Where is it in the Suttas?

[DNS]

Never heard of that one. Where is it in the Suttas?

In the Khuddakapatha, Sutta Nipata and Theragatha. Here is a passage from Theragatha (sorry couldn't find it in English, sprechen sie deutsch?)

https://suttacentral.net/thag7.4/de/sass

The last part mentions taking ordination at age 7 and wearing the last body.

[alan]

That link did not work. I'll try it again tomorrow morning.

[DNS]

That link did not work. I'll try it again tomorrow morning.

It was in German. Here is the google translate rendering to English:

Saw him in the terrace shade,
the highest, go up and down,
I slowly went to him,
greeted him, the highest man.

"Cover my robe first,
and I fold my hands under her,
Will I follow the flawless,
the highest of all living beings. "

Since he asked questions,
the questioner, knowing, -
and fearless, whole and without fear
she told Master Me.

And about these questions answer
pleased was the Tathāgato,
looked at his bhikkhu crowd,
said this meaning to himself:

"How good for Magadhā, Angāna,
where he enjoys everything easily:
the robe and the beggar's walk,
keep and camp seat,
getting up and going right,
how good for her "-so he said.

"Sopāka, today you are with me,
to see me, approached-
This step, Sopāka, just
I want you to be ordained. "

Was seven years after birth,
when I took the ordination,
From now on, wear my last body.
Oh, this Dhamma Core Law!

[Disciple]

So. I've learned at least one thing from this: There is such a thing called called Bon.
But, I don't care. Because it seems to be completely ridiculous.
Just like the idea that there could be a child lama.

There could not be a Child Lama, right?
In the Suttas, nothing like that was ever said.

Tibetan invention.