Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

A forum for Dhamma resources in languages other than English
coconut
Posts: 1061
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:10 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by coconut »

Dhammanando wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 2:50 pm
coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:42 am Finally, no ariyas from heaven can be reborn yet..
The figures that you then give don't really support this claim, for they are the devas' maximum lifespan, not the average. But not every deva has enough merit to reach the maximum lifespan, just as not every human has enough to reach "a hundred years or a little over a hundred" - the human maximum for the present aeon.
Even if we cut the deva's lifespan by 75% (which is like a human dying at age 25), that's still 3,750 human years from now.

500 - 375 (75% off) = 125 - 50 (subtracting 2,500 human years) = 75 deva years x 50 = 3,750 human years remaining

For a deva to die and be reborn now, they would have to die at age 50 (deva years), which is equivalent to a human dying at age 10.
User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 5877
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Mae Wang Huai Rin, Li District, Lamphun

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by Dhammanando »

coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:45 pm if we cut the deva's lifespan by 75%
... then your point would still stand. But why arbitrarily stop at 75%? In commentarial narratives about opapātika beings, some pass away on the very same day that they apparitionally arose; e.g., devas with minimal puñña, hell-beings and ghosts with minimal pāpa.
Anabhirati kho, āvuso, imasmiṃ dhammavinaye dukkhā, abhirati sukhā.

“To not delight in this dhammavinaya, friend, is painful; to delight in it is bliss.”
(Sukhasutta, AN 10:66)
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

The biiggest problem here is no account of Sotapanna or Sakdagami appeared in Buddha’s life time as per Tripitaka.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Lal
Posts: 552
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 11:39 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by Lal »

The biiggest problem here is no account of Sotapanna or Sakdagami appeared in Buddha’s life time as per Tripitaka.
I just did a search on Sutta Central with the keyword "sakadagami":
https://suttacentral.net/search?query=sakadagami

You should be able to see enough suttas. You can try the same with other keywords of Sotapanna, etc.
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

Dhammanando wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 1:15 am
coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:45 pm if we cut the deva's lifespan by 75%
... then your point would still stand. But why arbitrarily stop at 75%? In commentarial narratives about opapātika beings, some pass away on the very same day that they apparitionally arose; e.g., devas with minimal puñña, hell-beings and ghosts with minimal pāpa.
Bhante.
Are there any accounts in Sutta that Sotapanna or Sakdagami was reborn in Buddha’s time?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User avatar
DooDoot
Posts: 10013
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:06 pm

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by DooDoot »

SarathW wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:41 am Are there any accounts in Sutta that Sotapanna or Sakdagami was reborn in Buddha’s time?
No. Bhante has answered this question many times on this forum. They are all reborn in deva realm.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

DooDoot wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 3:28 am
SarathW wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:41 am Are there any accounts in Sutta that Sotapanna or Sakdagami was reborn in Buddha’s time?
No. Bhante has answered this question many times on this forum. They are all reborn in deva realm.
Thanks. I can recall it but I can’t find the link.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:42 am There's no way she's 3 and a half years old. She's 6-10 years old, also that angle makes her look younger, in the other videos she looks older, and she could have possibly been born prematurely if she's around 9-10. I'd wager to say she's around 7 years old and of a smaller stature.

This is what a 3 year old child looks like

https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/childdevelop ... -300px.jpg

She's clearly older than these kids who are 6 years old



Also, it's clear by the videos on that channel that the man has been training her from a young age. I'm skeptical. I would not want to impose dhamma at that level onto kids. At best just stick to the virtue training until they're young adults, and then go into no-self and all that.

Finally, no ariyas from heaven can be reborn yet..
“For the devas ruled by the four great kings, a single night and day is equivalent to fifty human years; thirty such days make up a month, and twelve such months make up a year. The life span of those devas is five hundred such celestial years. It is possible, bhikkhus, for a woman or man who observes the uposatha complete in these eight factors, with the breakup of the body, after death, to be reborn in companionship with the devas ruled by the four great kings. It was with reference to this that I said human kingship is poor compared to celestial happiness.

1 lowest heaven year = 50 human years

2500 human years ago = 50 lowest deva years ago.

Average lifespan for lowest deva years is 500 celestial years. Therefore the lowest devas will not die for another 22,500 human years.


I also doubt she would be from a previous dispensation like Buddha Kassapa's.
I have no doubt this child has been indoctrinated by her father or by a monk. How ever I see three miracles here.
- Miracle of teaching. The father or the monk has a very deep knowledge of the teaching. So they were able to teach this to a 7 years old child.
- Miracle of learning. How did this child learn and teach it back to here father? She is a child pedigree no doubt.
- the miracle of comprehension. To be honest I leant Ed from her some interesting facts. Thirty one coscousness. No body had given a reply yo my previous question. I. Ask this from a very knowledgeable monk he said it could be from a Atua or Tika.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User avatar
confusedlayman
Posts: 4307
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
Location: Human Realm (as of now)

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by confusedlayman »

SarathW wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 6:43 am
coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:42 am There's no way she's 3 and a half years old. She's 6-10 years old, also that angle makes her look younger, in the other videos she looks older, and she could have possibly been born prematurely if she's around 9-10. I'd wager to say she's around 7 years old and of a smaller stature.

This is what a 3 year old child looks like

https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/childdevelop ... -300px.jpg

She's clearly older than these kids who are 6 years old



Also, it's clear by the videos on that channel that the man has been training her from a young age. I'm skeptical. I would not want to impose dhamma at that level onto kids. At best just stick to the virtue training until they're young adults, and then go into no-self and all that.

Finally, no ariyas from heaven can be reborn yet..
“For the devas ruled by the four great kings, a single night and day is equivalent to fifty human years; thirty such days make up a month, and twelve such months make up a year. The life span of those devas is five hundred such celestial years. It is possible, bhikkhus, for a woman or man who observes the uposatha complete in these eight factors, with the breakup of the body, after death, to be reborn in companionship with the devas ruled by the four great kings. It was with reference to this that I said human kingship is poor compared to celestial happiness.

1 lowest heaven year = 50 human years

2500 human years ago = 50 lowest deva years ago.

Average lifespan for lowest deva years is 500 celestial years. Therefore the lowest devas will not die for another 22,500 human years.


I also doubt she would be from a previous dispensation like Buddha Kassapa's.
I have no doubt this child has been indoctrinated by her father or by a monk. How ever I see three miracles here.
- Miracle of teaching. The father or the monk has a very deep knowledge of the teaching. So they were able to teach this to a 7 years old child.
- Miracle of learning. How did this child learn and teach it back to here father? She is a child pedigree no doubt.
- the miracle of comprehension. To be honest I leant Ed from her some interesting facts. Thirty one coscousness. No body had given a reply yo my previous question. I. Ask this from a very knowledgeable monk he said it could be from a Atua or Tika.
those who learn and try to understand dhamma will have increasing intelligence day by day... my prespective and intelligence increased compared to before learning dhamma and after learning... I am sure that kid was taught dhamma and she grasped it using analogy and now he will out perform her peers in school because her way of thinking will be superior to non dhammic beings
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
User avatar
confusedlayman
Posts: 4307
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
Location: Human Realm (as of now)

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by confusedlayman »

Dhammanando wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 1:15 am
coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:45 pm if we cut the deva's lifespan by 75%
... then your point would still stand. But why arbitrarily stop at 75%? In commentarial narratives about opapātika beings, some pass away on the very same day that they apparitionally arose; e.g., devas with minimal puñña, hell-beings and ghosts with minimal pāpa.
dont devas have fixed life time unless they do bad karma by attacking arhants or buddha or ariyas?
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
coconut
Posts: 1061
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:10 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by coconut »

Dhammanando wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 1:15 am
coconut wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:45 pm if we cut the deva's lifespan by 75%
... then your point would still stand. But why arbitrarily stop at 75%? In commentarial narratives about opapātika beings, some pass away on the very same day that they apparitionally arose; e.g., devas with minimal puñña, hell-beings and ghosts with minimal pāpa.
I see, so that would be like dying at birth. Would a sotapanna have such low merit that they die at birth? In the suttas, when a new sotapanna deva is born it says they "outshine" the other devas, like for example the leper who spat on a paccekabuddha in a previous life, then heard gotama Buddha's teaching, died, and then was born a deva who outshined the rest. So it would seem to me that a sotapanna would not die upon becoming a deva. My memory is a little rusty, but isn't there a sutta that says sotapannas have long lives and are reborn to a wealthy family?

I remember reading a sutta of how devas die from arguing with eachother. They lose mindfulness, anger arises, and they die. It's been a long time since I've seen that sutta.
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

As far as I know, her father never said that she is talking about the past life. There are no claims by him that she was a Sotapanna in her previous life. This Sotapana idea came from a person who made a comment on her video.it papers that Waharka school (Lal) is trying to use this to justify the story that Wharaka thero was a Sotapanna in his previous life.
Last edited by SarathW on Sun Jan 31, 2021 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
coconut
Posts: 1061
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:10 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by coconut »

confusedlayman wrote:
those who learn and try to understand dhamma will have increasing intelligence day by day... my prespective and intelligence increased compared to before learning dhamma and after learning... I am sure that kid was taught dhamma and she grasped it using analogy and now he will out perform her peers in school because her way of thinking will be superior to non dhammic beings
I don't think that's what being intelligent means. She could be intelligent, not denying that. However, there are people who can barely string along sentences but could calculate complex sequences. Einstein was said to be extremely unintelligent in most areas, but exceptional in math. There are people who are autistic and savant, who appear to be completely dumb in most areas, but are geniuses in one area.

So intelligence is not a simple topic.
SarathW
Posts: 15219
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by SarathW »

Sachi discuss about 31 types of consciousness The attached video.
I like to know the Sutta reference as I have never came across before.

“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Lal
Posts: 552
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 11:39 am

Re: Three and half years old Sri Lankan child talk about Dependent origination.

Post by Lal »

I just came across the following video:



This is the same video where the little girl says she is three-and-a-half years old. This video was published on Sep 21, 2018. Click on "youtube" at the bottom right-hand to see the published date.
- If this publication is close to when the video was recorded, then she must be 5 1/2 years old now.

In any case, it is fruitless to debate how old she is.
- If someone can truly understand what she is saying in these videos, they would realize that even an adult cannot express such deep Dhamma.
- Unfortunately, not many people have enough understanding of pure Buddha Dhamma.
Post Reply