first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
- confusedlayman
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Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
buddhaghosa is arhant because what he said he experienced by him I think.. what he didn't experience or say he mentioned the source if im not wrong
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
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Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
So much nonsense and half baked ideas. I have read the Vism. and found it interesting but also deficient. Buddhaghosa was not an arahant... he even wished for a good rebirth (although apologists will say that the wish was put in by someone else).
People will believe (love) what they want to believe. I believe in the suttas and any teaching that supports them; whether from ancient or modern commentators.
I don't believe in deifying a book; especially one that has major discrepancies with the suttas.
People will believe (love) what they want to believe. I believe in the suttas and any teaching that supports them; whether from ancient or modern commentators.
I don't believe in deifying a book; especially one that has major discrepancies with the suttas.
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
There is no need to repeat discredited smears of Ven. Buddhaghosa.BrokenBones wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:39 pm Buddhaghosa was not an arahant... he even wished for a good rebirth (although apologists will say that the wish was put in by someone else).
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
Vipassana is under the wisdom and mindfulness is under the samadhi. I think you are meaning mindfulness and jhana at the same time, not vipassana and jhana.frank k wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 4:33 pmbut not at the same time.confusedlayman wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 2:56 pm ...
Vism supports that meditator can do jhana and also vipasanna based on jhana
And that causes huge problems with how monastics do their main practice.
I've spend 10 years in that Vism. system and have witnessed hundreds, if not thousands of earnest diligent meditators suffering needlessly because they're following a misguided approach.
They spend years chasing a pure samatha, while neglecting the vipassana that would happen organically, holistically, and simultaneously with developing jhanas according to the EBT suttas.
I think the fault of the people you mention is that they try get concentration without purifying the mind. If mind is purified enough it attains jhana, or if to be more precise it attains the entrance spot.
Visuddhimagga,
and don't forget the jhana factors, since they are from what you know you are in jhana.pdf p197- wrote:Enters upon (upasampajja): arrives at; reaches, is what is meant; or else, taking
it as “makes enter” (upasampádayitvá), then producing, is what is meant. In the
Vibhaòga this is said: “‘Enters upon’: the gaining, the regaining, the reaching,
the arrival at, the touching, the realizing of, the entering upon (upasampadá, the
first jhána” (Vibh 257), the meaning of which should be regarded in the same
way.
..
111. “Of the first jhána, purification of the way is the beginning, intensification
of equanimity is the middle, and satisfaction is the end.
“‘Of the first jhána, purification of the way is the beginning’: how many
characteristics has the beginning? The beginning has three characteristics: the
mind is purified of obstructions to that [jhána]; because it is purified the mind
makes way for the central [state of equilibrium, which is the] sign of serenity;
because it has made way the mind enters into that state. And it is since the mind
becomes purified of obstructions and, through being purified, makes way for the
central [state of equilibrium, which is the] sign of serenity and, having made way,
enters into that state, that the purification of the way is the beginning of the first
jhána.
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
Indeed, those who say such things are literally lying by this point, unless they are extraordinarily ignorant and do not yet know that the copyeditor's colophon is clearly not Ven Buddhaghosa's. This has been discussed to death on this site, and I really can't believe in someone being a frequenter of the forum for so long and not knowing this. Maybe they just lack the critical skills to judge the assessment of the colophon as not being Ven Buddhaghosa's as obviously true.Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:37 pmThere is no need to repeat discredited smears of Ven. Buddhaghosa.BrokenBones wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:39 pm Buddhaghosa was not an arahant... he even wished for a good rebirth (although apologists will say that the wish was put in by someone else).
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
How do you know it? Were you present when the editor wrote the colophon? Ancient Indian colophons are usually very tightly connected to the content of the manuscript and form a continuum with it.Coëmgenu wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:30 pmIndeed, those who say such things are literally lying by this point, unless they are extraordinarily ignorant and do not yet know that the copyeditor's colophon is clearly not Ven Buddhaghosa's. This has been discussed to death on this site, and I really can't believe in someone being a frequenter of the forum for so long and not knowing this.Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:37 pmThere is no need to repeat discredited smears of Ven. Buddhaghosa.BrokenBones wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:39 pm Buddhaghosa was not an arahant... he even wished for a good rebirth (although apologists will say that the wish was put in by someone else).
It's just your belief, and Ceisiwr's belief that Visuddhimagga jhāna is "correct" (so Buddhaghosa must be an arahant).
How good and wonderful are your days,
How true are your ways?
How true are your ways?
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
The colophon is obviously not Ven Buddhaghosa's. I see we'll have to litigate this. More to come.
I don't really care if he was an Arhat or not, but he obviously didn't write that colophon.
I don't really care if he was an Arhat or not, but he obviously didn't write that colophon.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Thu May 13, 2021 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
It’s not a belief. Regarding if he was an Arahant or not, I have no idea. I do disagree with him on a few things.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
- confusedlayman
- Posts: 6258
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
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Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
Vism and suttas have no contradiction... people without personal experience are debating with bad understanding. If u want lite jhana its up to you but you yourself k ow it dont increase ur concentration for insight so no need to brag about it
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
and yet, your signature says:confusedlayman wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 5:20 pm Vism and suttas have no contradiction... people without personal experience are debating with bad understanding. If u want lite jhana its up to you but you yourself k ow it dont increase ur concentration for insight so no need to brag about it
Sorry to tell you this, but if you can't tell the differences between what the suttas and Vism. say,I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
you should shoot for a less ambitious signature and not assume you are learning at all.
www.lucid24.org/sted : ☸Lucid24.org STED definitions
www.audtip.org/audtip: Audio Tales in Pāli: ☸Dharma and Vinaya in many languages
www.audtip.org/audtip: Audio Tales in Pāli: ☸Dharma and Vinaya in many languages
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Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
It is not so much the colophon that makes me think that Buddhaghosa is not an arahant (although that in itself is suggestive and open to interpretation) it is the many discrepancies and his rewriting of jhana.Coëmgenu wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:30 pmIndeed, those who say such things are literally lying by this point, unless they are extraordinarily ignorant and do not yet know that the copyeditor's colophon is clearly not Ven Buddhaghosa's. This has been discussed to death on this site, and I really can't believe in someone being a frequenter of the forum for so long and not knowing this. Maybe they just lack the critical skills to judge the assessment of the colophon as not being Ven Buddhaghosa's as obviously true.Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:37 pmThere is no need to repeat discredited smears of Ven. Buddhaghosa.BrokenBones wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:39 pm Buddhaghosa was not an arahant... he even wished for a good rebirth (although apologists will say that the wish was put in by someone else).
Please note... open to interpretation... not lying... cool thy anger.
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
He rewrote nothing. He is relying upon the Aṭṭhakathā, which many take to be in agreement with the suttas on this point.BrokenBones wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 10:55 pmIt is not so much the colophon that makes me think that Buddhaghosa is not an arahant (although that in itself is suggestive and open to interpretation) it is the many discrepancies and his rewriting of jhana.Coëmgenu wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:30 pmIndeed, those who say such things are literally lying by this point, unless they are extraordinarily ignorant and do not yet know that the copyeditor's colophon is clearly not Ven Buddhaghosa's. This has been discussed to death on this site, and I really can't believe in someone being a frequenter of the forum for so long and not knowing this. Maybe they just lack the critical skills to judge the assessment of the colophon as not being Ven Buddhaghosa's as obviously true.
Please note... open to interpretation... not lying... cool thy anger.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
According to Buddhaghosa, the probability of anyone reaching immersion through nimitta kasina is 1 in 100,000,000.
For real. 1 in one thousand can’t reach the learning sign.
And so, on. I’d love to find the passage, but my love affair with Buddhaghosa ended a long time ago.
Thanks Ghosa, for all the good times. Imma stick to EBT’S from here on out.
For real. 1 in one thousand can’t reach the learning sign.
And so, on. I’d love to find the passage, but my love affair with Buddhaghosa ended a long time ago.
Thanks Ghosa, for all the good times. Imma stick to EBT’S from here on out.
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
Really? You are dropping the chakra stuff now?Pondera wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 11:08 pm According to Buddhaghosa, the probability of anyone reaching immersion through nimitta kasina is 1 in 100,000,000.
For real. 1 in one thousand can’t reach the learning sign.
And so, on. I’d love to find the passage, but my love affair with Buddhaghosa ended a long time ago.
Thanks Ghosa, for all the good times. Imma stick to EBT’S from here on out.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: first jhana really can be this easy (35 sec. video demonstration)
Was Buddhaghosa a chakra fan? I’m confusedCeisiwr wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 11:28 pmReally? You are dropping the chakra stuff now?Pondera wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 11:08 pm According to Buddhaghosa, the probability of anyone reaching immersion through nimitta kasina is 1 in 100,000,000.
For real. 1 in one thousand can’t reach the learning sign.
And so, on. I’d love to find the passage, but my love affair with Buddhaghosa ended a long time ago.
Thanks Ghosa, for all the good times. Imma stick to EBT’S from here on out.
Ohhhhhhhhhh. You’re saying EBT’S don’t represent chakras.
Well, I beg to differ, good man.
The colour kasinas are all represented in the body.
They happen to be aligned from ass to head like a rainbow coming out of a unicorn’s ass - from red to ultraviolet.
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded