Three realms

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mjaviem
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Three realms

Post by mjaviem »

... And what, bhikkhus, is existence? There are these three kinds of existence: sense-sphere existence, form-sphere existence, formless-sphere existence. This is called existence... —SN 12.2


Inferior realm

Now the pleasure and joy that arise dependent on these five cords of sensual pleasure are the gratification in the case of sensual pleasures. —MN 13

If, Ānanda, there were no kamma ripening in the sensory realm, would sense-sphere existence be discerned? —AN 3.77

And what, bhikkhus, is the escape in the case of sensual pleasures? It is the removal of desire and lust, the abandonment of desire and lust for sensual pleasures. This is the escape in the case of sensual pleasures. —MN 13


Middling realm

Now the pleasure and joy that arise in dependence on that beauty and loveliness are the gratification in the case of material form. —MN 13

If, Ānanda, there were no kamma ripening in the form realm, would form-sphere existence be discerned?" —AN 3.77

And what, bhikkhus, is the escape in the case of material form? It is the removal of desire and lust, the abandonment of desire and lust for material form. This is the escape in the case of material form. —MN 13


Superior realm

The highest gratification in the case of feelings is freedom from affliction, I say. —MN 13

If, Ānanda, there were no kamma ripening in the formless realm, would formless-sphere existence be discerned?" —AN 3.77

And what, bhikkhus, is the escape in the case of feelings? It is the removal of desire and lust, the abandonment of desire and lust for feelings. This is the escape in the case of feelings. —MN 13
Namo Tassa Bhagavato Arahato Sammā Sambuddhassa
SarathW
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Re: Three realms

Post by SarathW »

So your question is?
The following chart shows this in detail except for the last one cessation of perception and feeling (Nirodha Samapathi)

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dha ... /loka.html
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Ontheway
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Re: Three realms

Post by Ontheway »

Kamavacara realms included: Hells, Ghosts, Animal, Human, devas' realms (Catumaharajikā, Tavatimsa, Tusita, Yama, Nimmanarati, Paranimmitavasavatti), Asura realm (though still considered as a divine realm).

Rupavacara realms: Visible Brahma realms (Brahma Parisajja, Brahma Purohita, Maha Brahma, Parittabha, Appamanabha, Abhassara, Parittasubha, Appamanasubha, Subhakinna, Vehapphala, Asaññasatta, Aviha, Atappa, Sudassa, Sudassi, Akanittha).

Arupavacara realms: Invisible Brahma realms (Akasanañcayatanupaga, Viññanañcayatanupaga, Akiñcaññayatanupaga, Nevasaññanasaññayatanupaga).

There exists Devas, Brahmas, Ghosts, Asuras, Hells, etc. Secular Buddhism, supernatural being deniers, Buddhadasa (rejected Suttas with gods and other supernatural beings) were all wrong.
Hiriottappasampannā,
sukkadhammasamāhitā;
Santo sappurisā loke,
devadhammāti vuccare.

https://suttacentral.net/ja6/en/chalmer ... ight=false
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mjaviem
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Re: Three realms

Post by mjaviem »

SarathW wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 3:13 am So your question is?...
I don't know. Do you think kamma ripening means pleasure or pain (like in MN 46 "undertaking things now that ripen as pain or pleasure in the future)?

Do you agree that those in the material realm delight in beautiful and lovely things (while those in the sensual realm take delight in food, sexy bodies, sex, etc.)? Do you think the formless realm can be reached while very absorbed?
Namo Tassa Bhagavato Arahato Sammā Sambuddhassa
SarathW
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Re: Three realms

Post by SarathW »

mjaviem wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 9:46 am
SarathW wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 3:13 am So your question is?...
I don't know. Do you think kamma ripening means pleasure or pain (like in MN 46 "undertaking things now that ripen as pain or pleasure in the future)?

Do you agree that those in the material realm delight in beautiful and lovely things (while those in the sensual realm take delight in food, sexy bodies, sex, etc.)? Do you think the formless realm can be reached while very absorbed?
The ultimate of this existence is perception and feeling.
In that sense, it is reasonable to assume that Vipaka means the experience of perception and feeling.
That is why in Buddhism we transcend not only the unwholesome but also the wholesome.
However, Buddha allowed Jhanic pleasure for monks and certain sensual pleasure for laypeople.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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mjaviem
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Re: Three realms

Post by mjaviem »

SarathW wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 10:41 pm The ultimate of this existence is perception and feeling.
In that sense, it is reasonable to assume that Vipaka means the experience of perception and feeling.
That is why in Buddhism we transcend not only the unwholesome but also the wholesome.
However, Buddha allowed Jhanic pleasure for monks and certain sensual pleasure for laypeople.
I understand experience as feeling, how we are affected upon contact. We can have a pleasant experience, an unpleasant experience, or we can not be sure whether the experience is pleasant or unpleasant.

Since we are ignorant we mistake gratification with happiness. Instead of abandoning craving for sensual pleasures, existence, or non-existence we seek delight in food, sex, and other sensual pleasures or we seek delight in higher elements for example a beautiful landscape in the sunset, a lovely song, or an inspiring spirituality story. Or if advanced enough, none of that, we seek delight in the purest experiences of all. But doing this keeps us in samsara and our good and bad actions determine whether we get this gratifying pleasures we are so eager of or not.

If only we could understand and practise accordingly.
Namo Tassa Bhagavato Arahato Sammā Sambuddhassa
SarathW
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Re: Three realms

Post by SarathW »

we seek delight in higher elements for example a beautiful landscape in the sunset, a lovely song, or an inspiring spirituality story.
I think what matters is the clinging (Upadana)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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mjaviem
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Re: Three realms

Post by mjaviem »

SarathW wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 4:09 am
we seek delight in higher elements for example a beautiful landscape in the sunset, a lovely song, or an inspiring spirituality story.
I think what matters is the clinging (Upadana)
SN 22.65 Bodhi wrote:...
“Venerable sir, it would be good if the Blessed One would teach me the Dhamma in brief….”

“Bhikkhu, in seeking delight one is bound by Mara; by not seeking delight one is freed from the Evil One.”

“Understood, Blessed One! Understood, Fortunate One!”
...
Namo Tassa Bhagavato Arahato Sammā Sambuddhassa
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