Are there Eternalists here?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Coëmgenu »

It would be more useful to criticized your attā views than to criticize your reading comprehension.

You equate worldly death with annihilation. You claim that your views are not eternalism because you believe that the self/soul "changes" and that eternalism requires an "unchanging" self/soul.

It's pretty easy to find you on this board arguing these very points.

What you do not consider is "partial eternalism," which allows for parts of the self/soul/attā/ātman to change while a certain eternal part of the self or soul or mind doesn't change and instead experiences the changes of the other parts. That certain part that does not change is "eternalism" all the same.

So regardless if you believe that you change or not, if on some level you believe that "Cappuccino will not die," you are an eternalist. If I, on some level (any level!), believe that "Coëmgenu will not die," then I'm an eternalist, even if I do not consider all that is "Coëmgenu" to be an unchanging entity.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 1:09 pm You equate worldly death with annihilation.
I equate no self with annihilationism


because the Buddha equates it
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

I equate self with eternalism


And not self… is correct
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Coëmgenu »

Like Vacchagotta before you.

To be fair, I don't think that the Buddha, if he had to give instructions to the members of this forum, would teach anattā here to many. Anattā was clearly a more carefully guarded teaching in the past, unlike how it is casually bandied about and "popified" today. The Buddha was clearly very concerned about its correct interpretation, declining to teach Vacchagotta about it due to his confusion and rebuking Sati rather strongly for saying that he understood the Buddha's Dharma to be in violation of the principle.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Mon Jul 04, 2022 1:28 pm, edited 4 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 1:24 pm Like Vacchagotta before you.
I am Buddhist
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Ceisiwr »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 1:24 pm Like Vacchagotta before you.

To be fair, I don't think that the Buddha, if he had to give instructions to the members of this forum, would teach anattā here to many. Anattā was clearly a more carefully guarded teaching in the past, unlike how it is casually bandied about and "popified" today. The Buddha was clearly very concerned about its correct interpretation, declining to teach Vacchagotta about it due to his confusion and rebuking Sati rather strongly for saying that he understood the Buddha's Dharma to be in violation of the principle.
I agree. Today a lot of people are exposed to teachings they aren’t ready for yet if even at all in this life. It creates all kinds of confusion, as evidenced by many posters here past and present. Anatta is hard, and easy to get wrong.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Ceisiwr wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 2:24 pm Anatta is hard, and easy to get wrong.
no self is the popular view


everyone understands it, so to speak
Last edited by cappuccino on Mon Jul 04, 2022 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

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Coëmgenu
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Coëmgenu »

That Hindu/Zen teacher frequently contradicts himself.



Maybe he's brilliant in his way, maybe he's foolish in other peoples' ways, but either way I think your posting of him is being taken severely out of context. As a Vendantist and a Zen practitioner, Adyaśānti believes in the "great Ātman" or, as it's known in Zen, the "True Self."
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:00 pm Maybe he's brilliant in his way, but either way I think your posting of him is being taken severely out of context.
You did not watch the video
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Coëmgenu »

I watched both videos, and have watched many other videos from him. About 5. That's enough for me.

I just found out that he also studied Zen, where they sometimes believe in the "true self." Go figure. I edited my above post correspondingly.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:04 pm I watched both videos, and have watched many other videos from him. About 5. That's enough for me.
I must have watched a thousand
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by Coëmgenu »

I think that watching too much of him might melt the brain. Then again, that's likely what he's going for. Melt the brain and discover "now." As he says, the brain exists in the past and future always. Your true being is in the "now," which your brain can never get to, due to the delay between seeing an object and mentally processing the experience.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

Coëmgenu wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:04 pm I just found out that he also studied Zen, where they sometimes believe in the "true self."
youtu.be/OQT6FWOmkOU?t=300
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cappuccino
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Re: Are there Eternalists here?

Post by cappuccino »

I’m trying to show you that no self is not Buddhism
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