Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

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Padmist
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Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Padmist »

I'm not sure if it's the first or second council. But basically, this disciple arrived late.

This may even be the same disciple who was away for some time and when he came back, the Buddha already went for parinivana. That or this disciple said that he too heard teachings from the Buddha. Not just Ananda.
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by DNS »

At the First Buddhist Council, 500 arahants were to convene to recite the Nikayas and Vinaya. But Ananda, the attendant to the Buddha was not yet an arahant. At the last minute, just a day before convening, Ananda did attain full enlightenment. He practiced diligently and went to lie down in his bed and just as his head was about to hit the pillow, he achieved full awakening.

Not sure if that is what you are remembering or if there is another disciple at this Council or a later one.
Padmist
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Padmist »

DNS wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:47 am At the First Buddhist Council, 500 arahants were to convene to recite the Nikayas and Vinaya. But Ananda, the attendant to the Buddha was not yet an arahant. At the last minute, just a day before convening, Ananda did attain full enlightenment. He practiced diligently and went to lie down in his bed and just as his head was about to hit the pillow, he achieved full awakening.

Not sure if that is what you are remembering or if there is another disciple at this Council or a later one.
Another disciple. If I remember correctly, there is a disciple who refused to accept Ananda's accounts of the things heard from the Buddha and he said that he too remember the things he heard fromt he Buddha.
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Mumfie
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Mumfie »

Padmist wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:56 am Another disciple. If I remember correctly, there is a disciple who refused to accept Ananda's accounts of the things heard from the Buddha and he said that he too remember the things he heard fromt he Buddha.
That was the venerable Purāṇa. He had a big following but I've never seen any details about him but the one here:-

Now at that time the venerable Purāṇa was walking on almstour in the Southern Hills together with a large Order of monks, with at least five hundred monks. Then the venerable Purāṇa, having stayed in the Southern Hills for as long as he found suiting, after the monks who were elders had chanted dhamma and discipline , approached Rājagaha, the Bamboo Grove, the squirrels’ feeding place, and the monks who were elders; having approached, having exchanged friendly greetings with the monks who were elders, he sat down at a respectful distance. The monks who were elders spoke thus to the venerable Purāṇa as he was sitting down at a respectful distance:

“Reverend Purāṇa, dhamma and discipline have been chanted by monks who are elders. Submit yourself to this chanting.”

“Your reverences, well chanted by the elders are dhamma and discipline, but in that way that I heard it in the Lord’s presence, that I received it in his presence, in that same way will I bear it in mind.”
Bundokji
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Bundokji »

You might be referring to Ven. Mahākassapa? he was late for the Buddha's funeral, but not the council. He also argued with Ven. Ananda during the first council.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by justindesilva »

Bundokji wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:30 am You might be referring to Ven. Mahākassapa? he was late for the Buddha's funeral, but not the council. He also argued with Ven. Ananda during the first council.
From what I have gathered I understand that Ananda thero delayed attending the 1!st council until he knew he became an arhant .
He had become an arhant in a posture neither sitting nor sleeping when he decided to attend the 1st council. Others were waiting for his arrival because he could remember all that budda uttered as damma.
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by confusedlayman »

Mumfie wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:20 am
Padmist wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:56 am Another disciple. If I remember correctly, there is a disciple who refused to accept Ananda's accounts of the things heard from the Buddha and he said that he too remember the things he heard fromt he Buddha.
That was the venerable Purāṇa. He had a big following but I've never seen any details about him but the one here:-

Now at that time the venerable Purāṇa was walking on almstour in the Southern Hills together with a large Order of monks, with at least five hundred monks. Then the venerable Purāṇa, having stayed in the Southern Hills for as long as he found suiting, after the monks who were elders had chanted dhamma and discipline , approached Rājagaha, the Bamboo Grove, the squirrels’ feeding place, and the monks who were elders; having approached, having exchanged friendly greetings with the monks who were elders, he sat down at a respectful distance. The monks who were elders spoke thus to the venerable Purāṇa as he was sitting down at a respectful distance:

“Reverend Purāṇa, dhamma and discipline have been chanted by monks who are elders. Submit yourself to this chanting.”

“Your reverences, well chanted by the elders are dhamma and discipline, but in that way that I heard it in the Lord’s presence, that I received it in his presence, in that same way will I bear it in mind.”
This is very new thing to me. I see this statement only now. Where do you find this statement?
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Bundokji »

justindesilva wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:21 am From what I have gathered I understand that Ananda thero delayed attending the 1!st council until he knew he became an arhant .
He had become an arhant in a posture neither sitting nor sleeping when he decided to attend the 1st council. Others were waiting for his arrival because he could remember all that budda uttered as damma.
I was trying to help the OP identify the disciple he had in mind. Ven. Mahākassapa was away when the lord Buddha passed into parinibbāna, and the pyre wont lit until he arrived to pay homage to the Buddha's feet. From what i know, it was not Ven. Ananda who delayed attending the first council, but it was a requirement that the council to be made of Arahants. It happened that he attained Arahantship in a timely manner to attend the council.

Also Ven. Mahākassapa asked Ven. Ananda to make confessions about few issues, including not asking the Buddha to differentiate minor rules from major rules.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
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Mumfie
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Mumfie »

confusedlayman wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:34 am This is very new thing to me. I see this statement only now. Where do you find this statement?
It's from the Cūḷavagga in Horner's translation.

https://a-buddha-ujja.hu/pli-tv-kd21--e ... r-brahmali
“Hobgoblin, nor foul fiend,
Shall daunt his spirit;”
John Bunyan, Pilgrim’s Progress II)
justindesilva
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by justindesilva »

Bundokji wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:49 am
justindesilva wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:21 am From what I have gathered I understand that Ananda thero delayed attending the 1!st council until he knew he became an arhant .
He had become an arhant in a posture neither sitting nor sleeping when he decided to attend the 1st council. Others were waiting for his arrival because he could remember all that budda uttered as damma.
I was trying to help the OP identify the disciple he had in mind. Ven. Mahākassapa was away when the lord Buddha passed into parinibbāna, and the pyre wont lit until he arrived to pay homage to the Buddha's feet. From what i know, it was not Ven. Ananda who delayed attending the first council, but it was a requirement that the council to be made of Arahants. It happened that he attained Arahantship in a timely manner to attend the council.

Also Ven. Mahākassapa asked Ven. Ananda to make confessions about few issues, including not asking the Buddha to differentiate minor rules from major rules.
May I please know how long was it when the first council was held after the parinibbana of lord budda. Not immediately after I presume .
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Bundokji »

justindesilva wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 5:02 pm May I please know how long was it when the first council was held after the parinibbana of lord budda. Not immediately after I presume .
I am not a historian, so i am not sure, but what i know that Ven. Mahākassapa decided to summon the council after hearing Ven. Subhadda's remarks challenging the monastic rules. I never heard that the council was delayed to admit Ven. Ananda as an Arahant.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
justindesilva
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by justindesilva »

Bundokji wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 5:50 pm
justindesilva wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 5:02 pm May I please know how long was it when the first council was held after the parinibbana of lord budda. Not immediately after I presume .
I am not a historian, so i am not sure, but what i know that Ven. Mahākassapa decided to summon the council after hearing Ven. Subhadda's remarks challenging the monastic rules. I never heard that the council was delayed to admit Ven. Ananda as an Arahant.
My apologies if I hurt your feelings. I only wanted to make sure of this fact but not test your knowledge . Thanks.
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Re: Name of the disciple who arrived late (or couldn't join) the Buddhist council?

Post by Bundokji »

justindesilva wrote: Thu Aug 11, 2022 5:49 am My apologies if I hurt your feelings. I only wanted to make sure of this fact but not test your knowledge . Thanks.
You did not hurt my feelings, friend. Thanks for showing care :heart:
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
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