Meditation and Cannabis

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
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Crazy cloud
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by Crazy cloud »

auto wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:57 pm
Crazy cloud wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:36 pm I could provide you with a lot of writings that proves my experiences, but think it is futile because we like to stick to our own beliefs. And nobody can argue or discuss beliefs. I'm okay with the results of the practice.
You mean you aren't capable to post anything in two lines.
Why should I?

Buddha provides us with 84000 different ways of letting go. Isn't that enough?
If you didn't care
What happened to me
And I didn't care for you

We would zig-zag our way
Through the boredom and pain
Occasionally glancing up through the rain

Wondering which of the
Buggers to blame
And watching for pigs on the wing
- Roger Waters
Donnyy
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by Donnyy »

Dhammapardon wrote: Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:58 pm Concentration strong enough and directed at the four sublime states can bring happiness and subsequent insight enough to break addictions.

Cannabis poses a somewhat unique challenge in how it crutches particular elements of a meditator's concentration. I think maybe similar to coffee helps people cast off sleepiness faster or to work better. Or maybe steroids help people lift heavier and be stronger. Maybe more similar to only listening to Dhamma from a wise and virtuous friend but never sitting in silence to practice one's own.

But once this tool is removed or lost or inaccessible, the user suffers because it was not their skill, but the tool that did the work (Wrong effort?). Then this meditator has more difficulty getting the same strong concentration enough to find the happiness and insight strong enough to break free of desire and craving to return to the crutch.

Even more danger, lots of cannabis use makes a person forgetful. It is easy to forget the teachings and become tangled further in the world. Maybe accidentally making bad Kamma. Maybe even further behind than before.

I think I agree with Crazy cloud in that unwise monkey mind will grab for the plants it wants and may become tangled. The way out is not to tell it "do not grab those plants". It already did grab those plants and maybe it is stuck. The way out is to show it is stuck and why so it can get out if it wants to.

Since this thread is not about addiction per se, and my posts are, this will be my last contribution.

These are my opinions and experiences I have encountered so far and I hope they bring further clarity like the rest of this thread brought for me as I continue to unstuck myself from my own cannabis addiction.
Be well.
You described what I thought about for a long time, but could not put it into words. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this.
For myself, I decided not to use cannabis. Lately, it seems to me that he only interferes with my meditation.
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Gwi II
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by Gwi II »

Violation of the fifth precept (intoxicating drinks AND SUBSTANCES THAT WEAKEN CONSCIOUSNESS).

I once read a source that said "drugs for meditation", that is OBVIOUSLY MISLEADING‼️ THAT'S THE PRACTICE OF A HERETIC ASCETIC‼️VIOLATION OF THE FIFTH PRECEPT‼️

VIOLATION OF THE FIFTH PRECEPT‼️

VIOLATION OF THE FIFTH PRECEPT‼️
Gwi: "There are only-two Sakaṽādins:
Theraṽādå&Ṽibhajjaṽādå, the rest are
nonsakaṽādins!"
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AgarikaJ
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by AgarikaJ »

Crazy cloud wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:45 pm
JamesTheGiant wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:17 am I'm not sure if it's relevant, but anyone using cannabis at any of the 10 or so monasteries I've stayed at (Thai, Sri Lankan, and Cambodian monasteries), would immediately be asked to leave.
They have almost zero tolerance for that.
Maybe there's a place for cannabis in Buddhism, but it's surely not within Theravada Buddhism.
What would happen if a lay disciple offered CBD oil (no THC) to the monastics?
And what about a monastic diagnosed with ADD/ADHD, - would it not be possible for that individual to take medicine for a condition like that?
You would be extremely surprised, how the Theravada forest monks -- just 80 years ago -- would have rejected all medicine or hospital visits, excluding medicine as specifically described in the Tipitaka (and this list is short). So being purist Theravada, consuming anything outside of the one meal time, not given to the monk during alms round specifically as food item, would have been off limits. Read the biographies of Ajahn Mun or Ajahn Chah to get a better idea what they would have likely told you.

Times very certainly have changed. If for the better, is a personal decision for you.

In the end, your practice is your practice alone and needs no outside validation besides what you think the Buddha said or meant (but when asking for such validation, it also might not be given, as you see in this thread).
The teaching is a lake with shores of ethics, unclouded, praised by the fine to the good.
There the knowledgeable go to bathe, and cross to the far shore without getting wet.
[SN 7.21]
McQueen
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by McQueen »

Drugs are bad, mmmkay.
Let's be friends.
Stefan7
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Re: Meditation and Cannabis

Post by Stefan7 »

My personal experience with abuse and addiction to hashish + tobacco is that they smeared everything inside of my mind and made me ignore almost everything that is important, this made me accumulate much suffering without even noticing, that came later to bite me. Even tobacco alone did that, every time I felt in distress I would smoke, making me ignore the suffering, but it accumulated.

Yes it can give you a sense of open mindedness and open you up to things like Buddhism like other psychedelic drugs (from what I've heard, I've never done anything besides hashish) but that's where the usefulness of the drug ends on the path imo, and eventually it should be dropped.

And although in the suttas there was a drunkard that became a sotapanna at the moment of death I don't think that should serve as a reason to keep indulging in drugs and alcohol, because the fifth precept exists for a reason.

I'm not judging anyone by the way, I used to do the same thing, but if one is honest and sincere with oneself the issues of drug and alcohol use become apparent and they can be eventually dropped, experiencing freedom from the complications their use brings.
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