Hello, my name is Steve and I am in the USA. I have been interested in Buddhism for several years, primarily Theravada but also some Mahayana. Recently I have been reading a lot more and I am trying to find what fits me. I like that Therevada is based on the original teachings of the Buddha, but I also find myself drawn to Mahayanan teachings at times. I am given to understand that Therevada broadly teaches that one essentially cannot become an arhant without being a monastic. This leads me to question why I would want to practice Therevadan Buddhism over a Mahayanan tradition like Chan. Is the overall goal to be reborn and perhaps become a monastic in another life while living the best life this time around that I can? Perhaps these questions are best for another thread.
Please forgive me if I am way off in any statements, spellings, thoughts, or otherwise am misunderstanding teachings, I am just starting.
Hello, still searching
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Re: Hello, still searching
Welcome to DW!
According to Theravada, one can reach full enlightenment as a lay person. Tradition holds that once one reaches full enlightenment, one ordains within 7 days or passes away.
There have been some threads about this, search for "lay arahant" or "arahant 7 days ordain" and it might show the previous threads. For me, it makes sense as in lay life one can still practice, make progress, but once there is full awakening, the lay life wouldn't be able to support full mindfulness all the time, equanimity, non-use of money, etc.
According to Theravada, one can reach full enlightenment as a lay person. Tradition holds that once one reaches full enlightenment, one ordains within 7 days or passes away.
There have been some threads about this, search for "lay arahant" or "arahant 7 days ordain" and it might show the previous threads. For me, it makes sense as in lay life one can still practice, make progress, but once there is full awakening, the lay life wouldn't be able to support full mindfulness all the time, equanimity, non-use of money, etc.
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Re: Hello, still searching
When I started practising one particular style, my progress was so fast that I freaked out at the posibility of dying if I reached Arahanship (I am a lay person), freak out as in emotional response not theoretical consideration. Few years down the road practicing and teaching meditation full time, inmerse in the Dhamma, I can tell you that my concerns were unfounded, I am not an Aranhant and I probably wont be one for a long time I first have to be an Anagami and a Sakadegami. Dont let your mind fool you around, the Pali Canon is the Pali Canon, all Buddhist schools aknowledge that. Its what the Buddha taught.tampasteve2 wrote:Hello, my name is Steve and I am in the USA. I have been interested in Buddhism for several years, primarily Theravada but also some Mahayana. Recently I have been reading a lot more and I am trying to find what fits me. I like that Therevada is based on the original teachings of the Buddha, but I also find myself drawn to Mahayanan teachings at times. I am given to understand that Therevada broadly teaches that one essentially cannot become an arhant without being a monastic. This leads me to question why I would want to practice Therevadan Buddhism over a Mahayanan tradition like Chan. Is the overall goal to be reborn and perhaps become a monastic in another life while living the best life this time around that I can? Perhaps these questions are best for another thread.
Please forgive me if I am way off in any statements, spellings, thoughts, or otherwise am misunderstanding teachings, I am just starting.
Even if the flesh & blood in my body dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, I will use all my human firmness, human persistence and human striving. There will be no relaxing my persistence until I am the first of my generation to attain full awakening in this lifetime. ed. AN 2.5
Re: Hello, still searching
Well come to Dhamma Wheel.
Please find attached link related to Lay Arahants, which provide further links.
Please find attached link related to Lay Arahants, which provide further links.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Re: Hello, still searching
Welcome!
Liberation is the inevitable fruit of the path and is bound to blossom forth when there is steady and persistent practice. The only requirements for reaching the final goal are two: to start and to continue. If these requirements are met there is no doubt the goal will be attained. This is the Dhamma, the undeviating law.
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Re: Hello, still searching
Welcome to Dhamma Wheel!
Re: Hello, still searching
Hi Steve.
This would give you an idea of what was common in the early sects.
Saṃyutta/Samyukta have it all. All that is needed to understand the principles of Buddhism.
Particularly SN 12-Nidāna Saṃyutta, SN 22-Khandha Saṃyutta, SN 35-Saḷāyatana Saṃyutta, and SN 45-Magga Saṃyutta
The following link gives you the suttas with parallels: https://justpaste.it/11ovc
has it straight:
Citta the householder above cited in SN 41.9, did attain the non-returner stage with the faculty of concentration (and the previous ones, needless to say).
Interestingly enough, is the addition to this sutta in SN 48.18; where the Buddha says at the end:
"But, bhikkhus, I say that one in whom these five faculties are completely and totally absent is 'an outsider, one who stands the faction of worldlings.'"
Mudita
I suppose that what would be the best for you, would be to read the Saṃyutta (Nikayas)/Samyukta (Agamas).tampasteve2 wrote: I have been reading a lot more and I am trying to find what fits me.
I like that Therevada is based on the original teachings of the Buddha, but I also find myself drawn to Mahayanan teachings at times.
This would give you an idea of what was common in the early sects.
Saṃyutta/Samyukta have it all. All that is needed to understand the principles of Buddhism.
Particularly SN 12-Nidāna Saṃyutta, SN 22-Khandha Saṃyutta, SN 35-Saḷāyatana Saṃyutta, and SN 45-Magga Saṃyutta
The following link gives you the suttas with parallels: https://justpaste.it/11ovc
The Acela sutta SN 41.9 https://justpaste.it/11ovntampasteve2 wrote: I am given to understand that Therevada broadly teaches that one essentially cannot become an arhant without being a monastic
has it straight:
Try that already; then you'll see."In these thirty years, householder, have you attained any superhuman distinction in knowledge and vision worthy of the noble ones, any dwelling in comfort?"
"How could I not, venerable sir? For to whatever extent I wish, secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unwholesome states, I enter and dwell in the first jhana, which is accompanied by thought and examination, with rapture and happiness born of seclusion. Then, to whatever extent I wish, with the subsiding of thought and examination, I enter and dwell in the second jhana .. .. Then, to whatever extent I wish, with the fading away as well of rapture ... I enter and dwell in the third jhana ... .
Then, to whatever extent I wish, with the abandoning of pleasure and pain ... I enter and dwell in the fourth jhana. Further, if I were to die before the Blessed One does, it would not be surprising if the Blessed One were to declare of me: "There is no fetter bound by which Citta the householder could return to this world."
Although the Buddha is addressing the monks, He does not specify that this is dealing with monks only.Buddha wrote:"Bhikkhus, there are these five faculties. What five? The faculty of faith, the faculty of energy, the faculty of mindfulness, the faculty of concentration, the faculty of wisdom. These are the five faculties.
"One who has completed and fulfilled these five faculties is an arahant. If they are weaker than that, one is a nonreturner; if still weaker, a once-returner; if still weaker, a stream-enterer; if still weaker, a Dhamma-follower; if still weaker, a faith-follower . "
SN 48.12 (Bodhi)
Citta the householder above cited in SN 41.9, did attain the non-returner stage with the faculty of concentration (and the previous ones, needless to say).
Interestingly enough, is the addition to this sutta in SN 48.18; where the Buddha says at the end:
"But, bhikkhus, I say that one in whom these five faculties are completely and totally absent is 'an outsider, one who stands the faction of worldlings.'"
Mudita
In this world, there are many people acting and yearning for the Mara's world; some for the Brahma's world; and very few for the Unborn.
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Re: Hello, still searching
Thank you all for the clarification on lay arhants, that actually makes a lot of sense. I am just learning all of the foundations of Buddhism, so it is all new.
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Re: Hello, still searching
It's been a long time since I posted here, but I am still on my path. Searching and learning, getting back into some meditation.
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Re: Hello, still searching
May you fulfill your deepest wish for happiness.
May we all fulfill our deepest wish for happiness
We are already Buddha
We are already Buddha
Re: Hello, still searching
What has been your path remains your path sitting on the remains of your path is fertile grounds... although it is a samyojhana it is unstable and impermanent. Hopefully, no one has been following you as path for over ten years... As like a termite they will find you sweet when others abandon it the same as you abandon other paths in the search... In actual practice Satori is a blessing in real knowledge it is a demon that followed too long hungry for your life most serious practitioners concerned about your well-being or welfare that can no longer follow would refer to it as death yet to be conquered.tampasteve2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 7:20 pm It's been a long time since I posted here, but I am still on my path. Searching and learning, getting back into some meditation.
Such a consciousness is infinite as seen in the tail of no longer falling back held in the carkavartins grip the sutta for it is the tar trap of the monkey... or ensnared in five ways... people saying they have given up the five sensual strands are bragging about achieving jhana and nothing more.