How to be reborn into the various realms?

[Maarten]

I like to give to feel like a big shot.

No idea what realm that would take you. Hopefully not that of the Asuras.

Perhaps you should change it to: 'I'm a bigshot who's going to heaven!'

[bpallister]

maybe diva realm?

[santa100]

maybe diva realm?

I've heard of Deva realm, but diva realm? Sounds like a scary place to be...

phpBB .

[Maarten]

maybe diva realm?

Good news. My Divine Eye tells me you'll be reborn in the retinue of Barabara Streisand!

Enjoy!

[Ontheway]

Diva realm with "Mango"..... !?



I will take any chances with human realm.

[bpallister]

Thanks for the laughs, friends. I needed some after this depressing Ukraine news. May all beings be free from suffering.

[wenjaforever]

I think we are talking about the 2nd and 4th heaven correct? Every power and bliss are accumulated the higher you go. I think you don't lose any of the previous benefits of the lower realms. The higher your karma higher you go. But dukha is obliterated in the 1st and 2nd jhana. You probably don't want to go to the 3rd and 4th jhana since sukha is obliterated here.

Please read Abrahamic religions on how to accumulate karma as well. For example if you're a Yama deva you can simply fly to and fro your harem no need to walk or ride horse or car.

[Ontheway]

Please read Abrahamic religions on how to accumulate karma as well.

I don't come across Jews, Christians or Muslims that talks about how their God, Jehovah or Allah Subanahu Wa'taala taught karma.

Karma is a special feature shared among Asian religions.

[TRobinson465]

I know breaking precepts will lead to the lower realms, and keeping them leads to the human realm. Having Jhana's and the Brahmaviharas lead to the Brahma realms, but how does one get into the other realms? If someone was aiming for Tavatimsa, or Tusita, etc, how would they go about it?

Its a combination of factors. There is the reason you give if you have no preference/don't know about the specifics of the afterlife.

The Sensuous World - 5 precepts, right speech, right view, and abandoning thoughts of covetousness and Ill will
Giving in order to get a good rebirth - The Four Great Kings
Giving because one believes giving is good - Devas of the Thirty-three
Giving out of tradition - Devas of the Hours
Giving out of compassion - Contented Devas
Giving to emulate holy men - devas who delight in creation
Giving because one enjoys it - devas who have power over the creations of others
Giving to make the mind more wholesome - Brahma's Retinue
No giving - the human realm

If you do know and you are of good character/meritorious you can basically pick where you go. I believe there is also a sutta that explains that what your last thought is at the moment of death is ultimately what makes that determination.

Even if you are of good character and have made merit regularly throughout your life, if you die angry or with ill-will or with a thought of something bad you did at the moment of death this can still lead you to the hell realm or some other unfortunate realm- albeit for a short period if your bad kamma is very light b4 you go up to the realm that is more in accordance with your accumulted kamma.

So its pretty complicated, as others have pointed out nothing is a guarantee unless you enlighten. But guard your conduct and mind and you will increase the chances of going to the realm you actually want to be reborn in.

Traditionally in Classical Theravada Buddhism you should train your mind to give to the Sangha rather than individual monks in order to maximize the amount of merit you generate, and when you make merit you are supposed to make an attdidana/wish that the merit allow you to go to the realm you want to go to upon death. You should also try to train your mind to give for one of the "higher" intentions above such as compassion, out of reverence for the great holy men, or with a clear and joyous mind to also maximize the amount of merit you accrue, even if you don't want to go to those particular realms, as simply having the intention to go to your desired realm is enuff if you have accumulated enough merit thru your good conduct and deeds. Doing these things dont guarantee it but it greatly increases the chances of going to your preferred realm.

I myself am aiming for Tusita in the next life so i can be with and hear the Dhamma from the various Bodhisattas presiding there, as well as be with many of my Buddhist friends from real life who also want to be born there as we await the birth of Lord Metteyya Buddha, and I frequently resolve to be born there when i make merit. This is if I don't achieve the ultimate goal in this life of course, but i am not so arrogantly delusional as many Western Buddhists are to have a nibbana in this life or bust mindset, so of course me (and many of my Buddhist friends IRL) have a backup plan for what's obviously the most likely scenario, dying without achieved the final goal yet and having to be reborn somewhere.

[Ontheway]

I know breaking precepts will lead to the lower realms, and keeping them leads to the human realm. Having Jhana's and the Brahmaviharas lead to the Brahma realms, but how does one get into the other realms? If someone was aiming for Tavatimsa, or Tusita, etc, how would they go about it?

Its a combination of factors. There is the reason you give if you have no preference/don't know about the specifics of the afterlife.

The Sensuous World - 5 precepts, right speech, right view, and abandoning thoughts of covetousness and Ill will
Giving in order to get a good rebirth - The Four Great Kings
Giving because one believes giving is good - Devas of the Thirty-three
Giving out of tradition - Devas of the Hours
Giving out of compassion - Contented Devas
Giving to emulate holy men - devas who delight in creation
Giving because one enjoys it - devas who have power over the creations of others
Giving to make the mind more wholesome - Brahma's Retinue
No giving - the human realm

If you do know and you are of good character/meritorious you can basically pick where you go. I believe there is also a sutta that explains that what your last thought is at the moment of death is ultimately what makes that determination.

Even if you are of good character and have made merit regularly throughout your life, if you die angry or with ill-will or with a thought of something bad you did at the moment of death this can still lead you to the hell realm or some other unfortunate realm- albeit for a short period if your bad kamma is very light b4 you go up to the realm that is more in accordance with your accumulted kamma.

So its pretty complicated, as others have pointed out nothing is a guarantee unless you enlighten. But guard your conduct and mind and you will increase the chances of going to the realm you actually want to be reborn in.

Traditionally in Classical Theravada Buddhism you should train your mind to give to the Sangha rather than individual monks in order to maximize the amount of merit you generate, and when you make merit you are supposed to make an attdidana/wish that the merit allow you to go to the realm you want to go to upon death. You should also try to train your mind to give for one of the "higher" intentions above such as compassion, out of reverence for the great holy men, or with a clear and joyous mind to also maximize the amount of merit you accrue, even if you don't want to go to those particular realms, as simply having the intention to go to your desired realm is enuff if you have accumulated enough merit thru your good conduct and deeds. Doing these things dont guarantee it but it greatly increases the chances of going to your preferred realm.

I myself am aiming for Tusita in the next life so i can be with and hear the Dhamma from the various Bodhisattas presiding there, as well as be with many of my Buddhist friends from real life who also want to be born there as we await the birth of Lord Metteyya Buddha, and I frequently resolve to be born there when i make merit. This is if I don't achieve the ultimate goal in this life of course, but i am not so arrogantly delusional as many Western Buddhists are to have a nibbana in this life or bust mindset, so of course me (and many of my Buddhist friends IRL) have a backup plan for what's obviously the most likely scenario, dying without achieved the final goal yet and having to be reborn somewhere.

Quite logical. Good aim.

I think in the Suttas, good layfollowers often reborn into Tusita, Tavatimsa, or Catumaharajika Heavens, after their death.

Eg: Anathapindika reborn to Tusita Heaven; Gopika the maiden reborn to Tavatimsa Heaven; King Bimbisara reborn to Catumaharajika Heaven.

Whenever I did a meritorious deed (sutta recital, Sanghadana, or worshipping the Triple Gems), I will usually recite a verse after as my aspiration:

"Imina puñña kammena,
Ma me Bala samagamo;
Satam samagamo hotu,
Yava Nibbāna pattiya.

By this meritorious deed I've done,
may I not associating with the fools;
let me associate with the wise ones,
till I attain Nibbāna.

Ayurarogya sampatti,
Sagga sampatti meva ca;
Atho Nibbāna sampatti,
Imina me samijjhatu.

Let me attain long life without diseases,
I shall attain the heavenly treasure (rebirth);
I shall attain the Nibbāna treasure (attain Arahanthood) too,
Let my wishes be accomplished."

When reach the word "Sagga", my mind inclined to Tavatimsa. And I used to do charity or Dana because I believe in the good kammavipaka from doing charity. I think my mind is inclined to Tavatimsa Heaven more.

But I think we should aim for Sotapannahood this life. Strive to practice and fulfill Hiri, Ottappa, Saddha, Sila, Suta, Caga and Pañña.

About the Dana technique, it was stated that the donor will need to have understanding in such Dana, like knowing why it is wholesome and also must believe/have confidence in such act of generosity. I used to read Dakkhiṇāvibhaṅgasutta prior to do Dana, to prepare my mindset.

Then when I offer food or items to the monks, I take the monks as a nimitta symbolising the Sangha. I offer the food/items to the Sangha instead of individual monk. I believe this is what we referred as Sanghadana, a donation made for the entire Sangha.

[TRobinson465]

But I think we should aim for Sotapannahood this life. Strive to practice and fulfill Hiri, Ottappa, Saddha, Sila, Suta, Caga and Pañña.

About the Dana technique, it was stated that the donor will need to have understanding in such Dana, like knowing why it is wholesome and also must believe/have confidence in such act of generosity. I used to read Dakkhiṇāvibhaṅgasutta prior to do Dana, to prepare my mindset.

Then when I offer food or items to the monks, I take the monks as a nimitta symbolising the Sangha. I offer the food/items to the Sangha instead of individual monk. I believe this is what we referred as Sanghadana, a donation made for the entire Sangha.

For sure. Aim for enlightenment, as we all should. But even then, sotapannahood only limits your future rebirths to 7. So even if you actually achieve this goal you still have to be reborn somewhere a few more times. So its not wise to completely ignore the next life. Your wishes (which i think were from Thai Pali chants as they seem very familiar) are very standard and sensible for pretty much anyone except for anagamis and arahants.

[Ontheway]

But I think we should aim for Sotapannahood this life. Strive to practice and fulfill Hiri, Ottappa, Saddha, Sila, Suta, Caga and Pañña.

About the Dana technique, it was stated that the donor will need to have understanding in such Dana, like knowing why it is wholesome and also must believe/have confidence in such act of generosity. I used to read Dakkhiṇāvibhaṅgasutta prior to do Dana, to prepare my mindset.

Then when I offer food or items to the monks, I take the monks as a nimitta symbolising the Sangha. I offer the food/items to the Sangha instead of individual monk. I believe this is what we referred as Sanghadana, a donation made for the entire Sangha.

For sure. Aim for enlightenment, as we all should. But even then, sotapannahood only limits your future rebirths to 7. So even if you actually achieve this goal you still have to be reborn somewhere a few more times. So its not wise to completely ignore the next life. Your wishes (which i think were from Thai Pali chants as they seem very familiar) are very standard and sensible for pretty much anyone except for anagamis and arahants.

The verses are not Thai origin. I got it from my chanting book (Sri Lanka tradition). The Thai tradition usually use "Idam me puññam asavakkhayavaham hotu; Idam me puññam Nibbānassa paccayo hotu."

Ya, you are right that we have still need to make preparations for next life as we can't attain Nibbāna this very lifetime.

For me, to attain Sotapannahood in this very lifetime is my main goal (and progressing).

Then, I will opt to reborn in Tavatimsa Heaven. It was recorded in the scripture that Cūḷāmaṇi-cetiya is now at Tavatimsa Heaven. For me, surely it is not a bad choice of reappearance. One can continue to practising Dhamma, listening to Dhamma discussion at Sudhamma Hall, and so forth.

Tusita Heaven seems far fetch to me though. But I read that among all sensuous heavenly realms, Tusita is the best choice as the Bodhisatta residing there now.

I also kinda agreed that if one wanted to be a Deva in next life... This life, the person will need to be a human version of "Deva" first. I remembered there is a term called " Manussadevo". I will exert effort to be a good capable person, build a harmonious life, put the teachings into practice (eg: filial piety, generosity, uphold precepts, reduce anger, etc).

[TRobinson465]

The verses are not Thai origin. I got it from my chanting book (Sri Lanka tradition). The Thai tradition usually use "Idam me puññam asavakkhayavaham hotu; Idam me puññam Nibbānassa paccayo hotu."

Oh okay, so perhaps a common origin then.

Ya, you are right that we have still need to make preparations for next life as we can't attain Nibbāna this very lifetime.

For me, to attain Sotapannahood in this very lifetime is my main goal (and progressing).

Then, I will opt to reborn in Tavatimsa Heaven. It was recorded in the scripture that Cūḷāmaṇi-cetiya is now at Tavatimsa Heaven. For me, surely it is not a bad choice of reappearance. One can continue to practising Dhamma, listening to Dhamma discussion at Sudhamma Hall, and so forth.

Tusita Heaven seems far fetch to me though. But I read that among all sensuous heavenly realms, Tusita is the best choice as the Bodhisatta residing there now.

I think you can still be reborn in a higher heaven and go down to Tavatimsa to pay homage to the Cūḷāmaṇi-cetiya. The Buddha's mom was reborn in Tusita but went down to Tavatimsa to hear him preach when he spent his vassa there i believe. And it was the Tusita devas who guarded the Buddha when he was a bodhisatta, showing him the 4 sights that caused him to leave the palace, etc.

For sure its definitely more difficult to be reborn in Tusita than Tavatimsa but just as its still a good idea to strive for enlightenment even if you know by sheer probability you probably wont make it, its a good idea to shoot for an ideal place like Tusita. Kids who ditch school to go to rap contests because they're "going to" become rappers when they grow up anyways are morons, but kids who are wise and prepare for a successful work life and career (by far the most likely scenario for 99%+ of aspiring stars) can still dream big and shoot for stardom.

Tavatimsa is probably my second choice if i dont make it but im definitely shooting for Tusita if i dont reach the final goal in this life so i dont have to deal with things like taking time out of my day to fight the Asuras, and the longer lifespan in Tusita increases the chances i can stay there until Lord Metteya's final rebirth and not risk being born on earth in a time where there isn't Buddhism. Plus, Tusita being the place my real life friends in this life want to go to makes it the clear choice/goal for me.

[Ontheway]

...

Plus, Tusita being the place my real life friends in this life want to go to makes it the clear choice/goal for me.

So all your Buddhist friends all making the same aspirations?

How you all make the aspiration after performing meritorious deeds? Verbally or in heart?

You will recite a verse similar to above ? or just thinking "by the merits I have accumulated, may I reborn to Tusita realm next life." ?

Normally, after I did a meritorious deed (eg: donation), I will first share the merits with all divine beings, then to all Peta ghost relatives. Then I will make aspiration to attain Sotapannahood sooner in this life and then Nibbāna. Then followed by the aspiration of rebirth to Tavatimsa Sagga, continuing the Dhamma practice till reaching Arahantship in final seventh lifetime.

[TRobinson465]

...

Plus, Tusita being the place my real life friends in this life want to go to makes it the clear choice/goal for me.

So all your Buddhist friends all making the same aspirations?

How you all make the aspiration after performing meritorious deeds? Verbally or in heart?

I'm not sure if you go to temples often, but usually if you go to pretty much any Buddhist temple they have some kind of resolution "By the power of the merit of this deed...." This is usually done in a group and verbally when your at any kind of group ceremony or merit-making event at a good chunk of temples.

As for the tusita wish specifically. No that is not on the public resolution verse. I just make the wish in my mind, but a good chunk (not all) of my Buddhist friends also make the wish to go to Tusita and be reborn in the era of Lord Metteya Buddha etc.

I'm sure my friends all have thier own resolutions when they make ones in thier head (as opposed to publicly during the merit-making event), but the commonality that we have is to be reborn in Tusita and be reborn in the era of Lord Metteya Buddha's dispension. My personal wish other than those two are just things like, always have right view, blameless livelihood, find Buddhism easily at a young age, be able to bring many others to the true Dhamma while I'm still in samsara, be able to ordain in every life where there's Buddhism, have hiri ottappa, etc. whenever i come back down to the earth and whatnot.