Summary for Visuddhimagga

[calakeeq1]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

[santa100]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

Assuming there's such a book, I don't think it'd help you much if you hadn't spent the time studying the full Vism. in details. Afterall, like you've said, the Vism. is a huge and very profound book, there's simply no shortcut to understanding it. One really needs to put in the time and effort to study it.

[SarathW]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

Assuming there's such a book, I don't think it'd help you much if you hadn't spent the time studying the full Vism. in details. Afterall, like you've said, the Vism. is a huge and very profound book, there's simply no shortcut to understanding it. One really needs to put in the time and effort to study it.

Agree.
To me Visuddhimagga seems like a summary of Buddha's teaching.

Good thing for us is, teaching is so simple.
But we can't get it.

[frank k]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

if you havent read it presumably, since you're asking for a summary, why would you assume it's profound?

[frank k]

...
To me Visuddhimagga seems like a summary of Buddha's teaching.

Good thing for us is, teaching is so simple.
But we can't get it.

So you've read all the suttas, have an idea of what it's saying,
and you've read all of Vism., and believe it accurately summarizes all of the suttas?

[frank k]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

I've read all of the pali suttas, many times,
and I've studied the sections in Vism. on jhāna extensively.
Here's a summary of where Vism's interpretation of jhāna differs from the suttas.
https://lucid24.org/sted/8aam/8samadhi/ ... index.html

I've also studied all of the jhāna and samādhi sections in vimuttimagga (vimt.) extensively.
https://lucid24.org/sted/ebt/not/vimt/v ... index.html

What's very interesting in comparing Vimt., and Vism., is that vism. was based off the Vimt.
Both are based on Abhidhamma, and both have approximately 40 meditation subjects.
But Vimt. for the most part remains quite faithful to the EBT pali suttas.

Abhidhamma Vibhanga on awakening factors and jhāna, aside from sukha being redefined as mental pleasure, does not contradict the EBT pali suttas too much.

Vism. though, takes the Abhidhamma commentary, which is not canonical, as the basis for redefining vitkakka and vicāra, and redefining jhāna as appana samādhi as a frozen disembodied stupor, contrary to the EBT jhāna which one has all 5 sense faculties active, can think, can hear sounds.

Another interesting note is appana samādhi in Vimt., simply meant that vitakka and vicāra (verbal thinking and exploration) is "fixed" (appana) on skillful Dharmas, and no longer wavering and wandering off too unskillful thoughts.
Vism. redefines appana as disembodied frozen stupor.

[frank k]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

Here's your one sentence summary of Vism. sections on jhāna:

While in the EBT (early buddhist teaching) pāḷi suttas, four jhānas is an embodied state of singular focus, lucid-discerning, all 5 senses operational, Vism. redefines jhāna as a disembodied frozen stupor whereby one uses a kasina to disengage mind from rūpa kāya for a predetermined amount of time.

[frank k]

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

Here's your one sentence summary of Vism. sections on jhāna:

While in the EBT (early buddhist teaching) pāḷi suttas, four jhānas is an embodied state of singular focus, lucid-discerning, all 5 senses operational, Vism. redefines jhāna as a disembodied frozen stupor whereby one uses a kasina to disengage mind from rūpa kāya for a predetermined amount of time.

The practical implications of that, are that in EBT, vipassana and samatha are joined, developed together holistically, organically, as part of a complete balanced diet of the noble eightfold path.
A low quality first jhāna is not hard to do, and is expected of even newly ordained monastics.

In the Vism. redefinition of jhāna, only one in a million serious meditators can get access concentration, (not even "jhāna"), samatha and vipassana are divorced and trained separately.
One is expected to develop samatha first before moving on the vipassana.

That is a profoundly different way to practice than what the Buddha taught.

[auto]

Here's your one sentence summary of Vism. sections on jhāna:

While in the EBT (early buddhist teaching) pāḷi suttas, four jhānas is an embodied state of singular focus, lucid-discerning, all 5 senses operational, Vism. redefines jhāna as a disembodied frozen stupor whereby one uses a kasina to disengage mind from rūpa kāya for a predetermined amount of time.

Per visuddhimagga pdf164,

If the meditation subject can bring 3rd and 4th jhana, then the jhana is attained by surmounting of factors.
For example, if your meditation subject is metta, then the jhana is attained by surmounting the joy.
It is the arupa jhana what is attained by surmounting the object.

Kasina isn't about disengaging the mind from rupa. Kasina is a meditation subject what brings jhana by surmounting of factor. So i presume in case of 1st jhana it is the sensual pleasure what is surmounted.

When the meditation subject what brings only the 1st jhana, for example the ten kinds of foulness together with mindfulness occupied with the body, then there is no surmounting. I guess the foulness won't give rise to sensual pleasure to surmount of..
----
I hope you are not buying into certain interpretations of people who have read visuddhimagga and abhidhamma and reach the conclusion which you seem following and trying to scare people off from that masterpiece.
don't let that ruin your entire effing life living with that interpretation??

[auto]

In the Vism. redefinition of jhāna, only one in a million serious meditators can get access concentration, (not even "jhāna"), samatha and vipassana are divorced and trained separately.
One is expected to develop samatha first before moving on the vipassana.

That is a profoundly different way to practice than what the Buddha taught.

I believe the 'one in a million' was expressed with a term 'rare' and in a context of person attaining access concentration and jhana in one sitting, is rare.

[SarathW]

...
To me Visuddhimagga seems like a summary of Buddha's teaching.

Good thing for us is, teaching is so simple.
But we can't get it.

So you've read all the suttas, have an idea of what it's saying,
and you've read all of Vism., and believe it accurately summarizes all of the suttas?

Yes, I have read about 85% of Sutta except Abhidhamma and Vinaya Pitaka.
However, I do not have done a profound academic analysis as you have done.
What I said was when I read Sutta I find they all say the same thing in different words.
Though Visuddhimagga is not a complete word-to-word representation of Sutta I found there is enough wisdom and look at the Sutt a in a different angle like Abhidhamma.
Even Sutta may not be the complete representation of what Buddha taught.
Because it is impossible to explain Nibbana in words.

[mikenz66]

Hi calakeeq1,

I am looking for summary for Visuddhimagga. It is a huge book and very profound. If someone has done a summary, please inform me.

CHAPTER IX. COMPENDIUM OF MEDITATION SUBJECTS of A Comprehensive Manual of the Abhidhamma: The Abhidhammatthasangaha of Acariya Anuruddha. may be helpful. It provides a summary of meditation subjects and progress of insight.

You can buy it or download the PDF here:
https://store.pariyatti.org/comprehensi ... abhidhamma


Mike

[frank k]

...
To me Visuddhimagga seems like a summary of Buddha's teaching.

Good thing for us is, teaching is so simple.
But we can't get it.

So you've read all the suttas, have an idea of what it's saying,
and you've read all of Vism., and believe it accurately summarizes all of the suttas?

Yes, I have read about 85% of Sutta except Abhidhamma and Vinaya Pitaka.
However, I do not have done a profound academic analysis as you have done.
What I said was when I read Sutta I find they all say the same thing in different words.
Though Visuddhimagga is not a complete word-to-word representation of Sutta I found there is enough wisdom and look at the Sutt a in a different angle like Abhidhamma.
Even Sutta may not be the complete representation of what Buddha taught.
Because it is impossible to explain Nibbana in words.

But you haven't read all of Vism.
So it's simply not rational to give an endorsement "To me Visuddhimagga seems like a summary of Buddha's teaching." like that,
especially when such a crucial piece of Dhamma, how one does the four jhānas, is drastically different between Vism. and suttas.
Among other major differences.

[frank k]

I don't think you actually understand what vism. says about jhāna, or have actually experience with the type of appana samādhi it's describing.
In EBT, you can have a verbal thought "may you be happy", feel pleasurable sensations in the physical body, see that person smile and hear them say, "thank you", simultaneously. Hearing, seeing, doing jhāna and metta all simultaneously.

In Vimt., you can also do all of that simultaneously (see, hear, think, metta, jhāna).

In Vism., you can do metta before "jhāna", or metta after "jhāna", but you can't do metta while you're in a frozen stupor with a mind frozen on a kasina with the person you were directing metta towards while you're in a disembodied frozen appana samadhi "jhana".

Here's your one sentence summary of Vism. sections on jhāna:

While in the EBT (early buddhist teaching) pāḷi suttas, four jhānas is an embodied state of singular focus, lucid-discerning, all 5 senses operational, Vism. redefines jhāna as a disembodied frozen stupor whereby one uses a kasina to disengage mind from rūpa kāya for a predetermined amount of time.

Per visuddhimagga pdf164,

If the meditation subject can bring 3rd and 4th jhana, then the jhana is attained by surmounting of factors.
For example, if your meditation subject is metta, then the jhana is attained by surmounting the joy.
It is the arupa jhana what is attained by surmounting the object.

Kasina isn't about disengaging the mind from rupa. Kasina is a meditation subject what brings jhana by surmounting of factor. So i presume in case of 1st jhana it is the sensual pleasure what is surmounted.

When the meditation subject what brings only the 1st jhana, for example the ten kinds of foulness together with mindfulness occupied with the body, then there is no surmounting. I guess the foulness won't give rise to sensual pleasure to surmount of..
----
I hope you are not buying into certain interpretations of people who have read visuddhimagga and abhidhamma and reach the conclusion which you seem following and trying to scare people off from that masterpiece.
don't let that ruin your entire effing life living with that interpretation??

[auto]

I don't think you actually understand what vism. says about jhāna, or have actually experience with the type of appana samādhi it's describing.
In EBT, you can have a verbal thought "may you be happy", feel pleasurable sensations in the physical body, see that person smile and hear them say, "thank you", simultaneously. Hearing, seeing, doing jhāna and metta all simultaneously.

In Vimt., you can also do all of that simultaneously (see, hear, think, metta, jhāna).

In Vism., you can do metta before "jhāna", or metta after "jhāna", but you can't do metta while you're in a frozen stupor with a mind frozen on a kasina with the person you were directing metta towards while you're in a disembodied frozen appana samadhi "jhana".

I meditate and get attainment. And i see the attainment coming afar, means i am near the concentration. And i do concentrate on an actual things what illuminate my mind, i see the mental object.
At the moment i do concentrate on a mental object its only that mental object on my focus. Depending on the meditation subject i can get concentration done while walking, but if the meditation subject is new to me, then i need stay put, to not lose the concentration.

Per abhidhamma, the appana is synonymous to beautiful(sobhana). If you reborn and have all senses intact then your life is based on kusala dhamma/beautiful state of mind.
Human birth in general is good.

In my mediation, when i am thinking about what people have said in forum, then i need cut those thoughts off if i want move towards attaining concentration.
The stupid verbal obsession over what someone has said comes up over and over again, that is to be cut off.

Lets say i obsess over someone saying there is no self, but they have no reason really to do so, it makes me mad. Last time i got over it by starting to glorify the Self. So in order to get over someone says nonsensical things over visuddhimagga, all i need do is say good things about it, like it is a masterpiece, and if i find my solace this way, and stop the intrusive thoughts arising i call it a success.