Greetings Ceisiwr,
retrofuturist wrote: ↑Sat Aug 13, 2022 2:18 am
I think you're under-estimating precisely what the breaking of the eighth fetter entails. It's the complete dissolution of any referrent to which pronouns could refer. Not merely the end of clinging to them.
Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Sat Aug 13, 2022 2:24 am
The Master still thought "I am hungry" otherwise he could never say "I am hungry".
More precisely, and in keeping with his own instructions...
SN 22.59 wrote:"Therefore, surely, O monks, whatever feeling, past, future or present, internal or external, coarse or fine, low or lofty, far or near, all that feeling must be regarded with proper wisdom, according to reality, thus: 'This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self.'
... he would have thought something closer to "hunger is present". Or as a Burmese Vipassana Traditioner would note "hunger, hunger".
If the Buddha needed to communicate his hunger to others, he would
then convert his thoughts to more conventional worldly parlance, per the above suttas, and in keeping with the aforementioned notion of
suddhaṃ saṅkhārasantatiṃ.
To think he still actually thought in terms of "I", other than as a means of communication, is to under-estimate the breaking of the eighth fetter. Further, I do not find your rendering of paticcasamuppada to be aligned to SN 22.59... too much has been puthujjana-ised in violation of SN 22.59.
Metta,
Paul.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."