sense bases disappear ?

[cappuccino]

You remind me of …

the alternative is self or no self

[Coëmgenu]

Yes, you feel that the middle way is between self and that which is not the self, no? We've had this conversation "a few" times in the past.

[cappuccino]

Yes, you feel that the middle way is …

Ananda Sutta: To Ananda
On Self, No Self, and Not-self

[Coëmgenu]

Like clockwork.

[cappuccino]

Like clockwork.

Is nothing at stake for you

[Coëmgenu]

Everything's at stake for everyone.

[cappuccino]

Everything's at stake for everyone.

K

[AlexBrains92]

Ananda Sutta: To Ananda
On Self, No Self, and Not-self

The statement "There is no Self" is not always false, just in the annihilationist sense:

And again, Ananda, when asked by the Wanderer: "Is there
no Self?", if I had answered: "There is no Self", then that would
have been a greater confusion to the already confused Vacchagotta.
For he would have thought: "Formerly indeed I had an
Self, but now I haven't got one".

In fact, the absence of a Self is the logical conclusion resulting from 'sabbe dhamma anatta'.
It's just subject to misunderstandings to state that directly.

[cappuccino]

The statement "There is no Self" is not always false

you don’t understand

[AlexBrains92]

you don’t understand

OK, cappuccino.

[Ceisiwr]

I have no idea what you will be reborn as.

I'd rather like you to answer this:

In relation to nama(-rupa), this is what you are suggesting:

Nama1-Rupa1 -> Nama2 -> Nama3-Rupa3

Well... this does not accord with DO, where we find no "pure nama".

Furthermore, there's no direct connection between subsequent consciousnesses. And even if so, it's a mistery how a "pure mental consciousness" would lead to another consciousness which is not a pure mental one, and viceversa before that.

As I've already wrote to Ceisiwr, there's no direct connection between subsequent consciousnesses. The illusory sense of consciousness continuity is due to this body continuity, which will eventually break up. Since there is no physical continuity between this body and an hypothetical gandharva, there can be no mental continuity either, not even an illusory one.

You can have consciousness with nāma on it's own in Buddhadhamma. As to the rest, I don't really understand what is you are trying to say.

[AlexBrains92]

I have no idea what you will be reborn as.

I'd rather like you to answer this:

In relation to nama(-rupa), this is what you are suggesting:

Nama1-Rupa1 -> Nama2 -> Nama3-Rupa3

Well... this does not accord with DO, where we find no "pure nama".

Furthermore, there's no direct connection between subsequent consciousnesses. And even if so, it's a mistery how a "pure mental consciousness" would lead to another consciousness which is not a pure mental one, and viceversa before that.

As I've already wrote to Ceisiwr, there's no direct connection between subsequent consciousnesses. The illusory sense of consciousness continuity is due to this body continuity, which will eventually break up. Since there is no physical continuity between this body and an hypothetical gandharva, there can be no mental continuity either, not even an illusory one.

You can have consciousness with nāma on it's own in Buddhadhamma. As to the rest, I don't really understand what is you are trying to say.

Of course you don't, since you wrongly understand namarupa as "mentality-materiality".

[Ceisiwr]

I'd rather like you to answer this:

You can have consciousness with nāma on it's own in Buddhadhamma. As to the rest, I don't really understand what is you are trying to say.

Of course you don't, since you wrongly understand namarupa as "mentality-materiality".

Nāma is your feelings, perceptions, intentions, contacts and attentions. These are all unique to you. Your own likes and dislikes, and so on. Your own mentality

mentality
/mɛnˈtalɪti/
noun
1. the characteristic way of thinking of a person or group.

Rūpa is the earth, fire, air and water element. They are the concrete stuff out of which you are made, according to Iron Age India. They aren't simply phenomenal ideas. That is a much later idea.

So, we have mentality & physicality. Your nāmarūpa. Your name & form is different to mine. Everyone's is unique. I suppose by continuity you mean some kind of individuality? Well, the stream of consciousness mixed up with different nāma and rūpa would be it. Part of nāma of course being kamma, when the āsava are there.

[AlexBrains92]

You can have consciousness with nāma on it's own in Buddhadhamma. As to the rest, I don't really understand what is you are trying to say.

Of course you don't, since you wrongly understand namarupa as "mentality-materiality".

Nāma is your feelings, perceptions, intentions, contacts and attentions. These are all unique to you. Your own likes and dislikes, and so on. Your own mentality

mentality
/mɛnˈtalɪti/
noun
1. the characteristic way of thinking of a person or group.

Rūpa is the earth, fire, air and water element. They are the concrete stuff out of which you are made, according to Iron Age India. They aren't simply phenomenal ideas. That is a much later idea.

So, we have mentality & physicality. Your nāmarūpa. Your name & form is different to mine. Everyone's is unique. I suppose by continuity you mean some kind of individuality? Well, the stream of consciousness mixed up with different nāma and rūpa would be it. Part of nāma of course being kamma, when the āsava are there.

I miss 2021's Ceisiwr:
viewtopic.php?t=40179
viewtopic.php?t=41617

[Ceisiwr]

Of course you don't, since you wrongly understand namarupa as "mentality-materiality".

Nāma is your feelings, perceptions, intentions, contacts and attentions. These are all unique to you. Your own likes and dislikes, and so on. Your own mentality

mentality
/mɛnˈtalɪti/
noun
1. the characteristic way of thinking of a person or group.

Rūpa is the earth, fire, air and water element. They are the concrete stuff out of which you are made, according to Iron Age India. They aren't simply phenomenal ideas. That is a much later idea.

So, we have mentality & physicality. Your nāmarūpa. Your name & form is different to mine. Everyone's is unique. I suppose by continuity you mean some kind of individuality? Well, the stream of consciousness mixed up with different nāma and rūpa would be it. Part of nāma of course being kamma, when the āsava are there.

I miss 2021's Ceisiwr:
viewtopic.php?t=40179
viewtopic.php?t=41617

When you look at the Pali it just doesn’t hold up that rupa in namarupa are “phenomena”. They are concrete nouns. There is a rupa which is mental, but that’s a mental representation of the physical.