Right speech

[DNS]

"In the case of words that the Tathāgata knows to be factual, true, beneficial, and endearing & agreeable to others, he has a sense of the proper time for saying them. Why is that? Because the Tathāgata has sympathy for living beings."
MN 58

[thepea]

Maybe you should. It's in the 8-fold path, right?

It’s a by-product of the selfish practice which is the 8-fold noble path.
Buddha didn’t reach nirvana being kind to his wife and son.

4 of the 8 path factors are other-regarding, so why do you call it a "selfish practice"? Or do you just ignore the parts you don't like?

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly. It’s completely selfish, and as a by-product of this practice(wisdom of sankharas) we develop in happy mind.

[Sam Vara]

It’s a by-product of the selfish practice which is the 8-fold noble path.
Buddha didn’t reach nirvana being kind to his wife and son.

4 of the 8 path factors are other-regarding, so why do you call it a "selfish practice"? Or do you just ignore the parts you don't like?

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

Yes, right speech involves never telling lies to your internal organs.

[Spiny Norman]

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

This is obviously incorrect, given that 4 of the 8 path factors are outward looking

[thepea]

Buddha didn’t reach nirvana being kind to his wife and son.

He taught Dhamma to them, he ordained them and they became arahants. There is no greater gift than that.

Yes, this is the story.... I wasn’t there to verify.
But he left them(according to story) to pursue his selfish obsession with ending sufferings. It was only as a by product of reaching the final goal that he taught to others.
Some may choose not to light the path.

[thepea]

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

This is obviously incorrect, given that 4 of the 8 path factors are outward looking

Expand.

[thepea]

4 of the 8 path factors are other-regarding, so why do you call it a "selfish practice"? Or do you just ignore the parts you don't like?

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

Yes, right speech involves never telling lies to your internal organs.

It’s not merely telling lies, it’s silence.

[Sam Vara]

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

Yes, right speech involves never telling lies to your internal organs.

It’s not merely telling lies, it’s silence.

So right speech is no speech? Does that mean all the path factors are complete abstinence, or just that one?

[Spiny Norman]

The entire 8-fold path is to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly.

This is obviously incorrect, given that 4 of the 8 path factors are outward looking

Expand.

Examine the factors of the 8-fold path, and see which ones are outward-looking or other-regarding.
I reckon 4 of them are.

[Aloka]

You know that the people you are talking to are unenlightened.

Even… on a Buddhist forum?

Especially on a Buddhist forum!

[thepea]

This is obviously incorrect, given that 4 of the 8 path factors are outward looking

Expand.

I see them all as internal. Which one do you feel is external?

Examine the factors of the 8-fold path, and see which ones are outward-looking or other-regarding.
I reckon 4 of them are.

[thepea]

Yes, right speech involves never telling lies to your internal organs.

It’s not merely telling lies, it’s silence.

So right speech is no speech? Does that mean all the path factors are complete abstinence, or just that one?

I’m saying they are meant to be developed inwardly, then a by-product will be external.
Do you teach speaking in satipatthana?

[Sam Vara]

It’s not merely telling lies, it’s silence.

So right speech is no speech? Does that mean all the path factors are complete abstinence, or just that one?

I’m saying they are meant to be developed inwardly, then a by-product will be external.

What does "developed inwardly" mean? If it means, as you say, "to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly" then presumably one is speaking to one's body-parts? And if Right Speech is, as you say, "silence", then that means one does not talk to one's body parts? Most people will be practising Right Speech, then, as few talk to their own bodies.

Do you teach speaking in satipatthana?

What's that got to do with the topic of Right Speech? Are you saying that the N8FP is not possible outside of some practice you call satipatthana?

[thepea]

You know that the people you are talking to are unenlightened.

Even… on a Buddhist forum?

Especially on a Buddhist forum!

It doesn’t matter if you speak to an enlightened or unenlightened individual, words cannot harm them unless they consent. Speech on its own is not capable of harming others. It can cause your own mind to be unsettled.

[thepea]

So right speech is no speech? Does that mean all the path factors are complete abstinence, or just that one?

I’m saying they are meant to be developed inwardly, then a by-product will be external.

What does "developed inwardly" mean? If it means, as you say, "to be practiced within the body. Not using the sense doors looking outwardly" then presumably one is speaking to one's body-parts? And if Right Speech is, as you say, "silence", then that means one does not talk to one's body parts? Most people will be practising Right Speech, then, as few talk to their own bodies.

Do you teach speaking in satipatthana?

What's that got to do with the topic of Right Speech? Are you saying that the N8FP is not possible outside of some practice you call satipatthana?

Your body is your temple, within this is all required.