Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

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SarathW
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Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by SarathW »

Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?
Which Sitta?
Why is this different from the Hindu belief that Brahmins were born out of Brahma's mouth?

“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Ontheway
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Ontheway »

Yes, the Buddha did as recorded in Anupada Sutta (MN111).

https://suttacentral.net/mn111/en/sujat ... ript=latin
Yaṁ kho taṁ, bhikkhave, sammā vadamāno vadeyya: ‘bhagavato putto oraso mukhato jāto dhammajo dhammanimmito dhammadāyādo no āmisadāyādo’ti, sāriputtameva taṁ sammā vadamāno vadeyya: ‘bhagavato putto oraso mukhato jāto dhammajo dhammanimmito dhammadāyādo no āmisadāyādo’ti.

Sāriputto, bhikkhave, tathāgatena anuttaraṁ dhammacakkaṁ pavattitaṁ sammadeva anuppavattetī”ti.


And if there’s anyone of whom it may be rightly said that they’re the Buddha’s true-born child, born from his mouth, born of the teaching, created by the teaching, heir to the teaching, not the heir in material things, it’s Sāriputta.

Sāriputta rightly keeps rolling the supreme Wheel of Dhamma that was rolled forth by the Realized One.”
It is a metaphor. It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.

But Brahmins' idea of it is different from Buddha's and they take it literally.
Hiriottappasampannā,
sukkadhammasamāhitā;
Santo sappurisā loke,
devadhammāti vuccare.

https://suttacentral.net/ja6/en/chalmer ... ight=false
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Johann
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Johann »

Ontheway wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:13 am

It is a metaphor. It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.

But Brahmins' idea of it is different from Buddha's and they take it literally.
So whats the different, good householder in Metaphor gross or refined? To do heir? Aren't good houesholder got birth by Brahma David NS like a like?

iti 100

This was said by the Blessed One, said by the Arahant, so I have heard: “I am a brahman, responsive to requests, open-handed, bearing my last body, an unsurpassed doctor & surgeon. You are my children, my sons, born from my mouth, born of the Dhamma, created by the Dhamma, heirs to the Dhamma, not heirs in material things.

“There are these two kinds of gifts: a gift of material things & a gift of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a gift of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of sharing: sharing of material things & sharing of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: sharing of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of assistance: assistance with material things & assistance with the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: help with the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of mass-donations: a mass-donation of material things & a mass-donation of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a mass-donation of the Dhamma.”



He who, unstinting,
made the mass-donation of Dhamma,
the Tathagata,
sympathetic to all beings:
to one of that sort
— the best of beings, human & divine —
living beings pay homage —
to one gone
to the beyond
of becoming.

Ontheway
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Ontheway »

Johann wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:34 am
Ontheway wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:13 am

It is a metaphor. It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.

But Brahmins' idea of it is different from Buddha's and they take it literally.
So whats the different, good householder in Metaphor gross or refined? To do heir? Aren't good houesholder got birth by Brahma David NS like a like?

iti 100

This was said by the Blessed One, said by the Arahant, so I have heard: “I am a brahman, responsive to requests, open-handed, bearing my last body, an unsurpassed doctor & surgeon. You are my children, my sons, born from my mouth, born of the Dhamma, created by the Dhamma, heirs to the Dhamma, not heirs in material things.

“There are these two kinds of gifts: a gift of material things & a gift of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a gift of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of sharing: sharing of material things & sharing of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: sharing of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of assistance: assistance with material things & assistance with the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: help with the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of mass-donations: a mass-donation of material things & a mass-donation of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a mass-donation of the Dhamma.”



He who, unstinting,
made the mass-donation of Dhamma,
the Tathagata,
sympathetic to all beings:
to one of that sort
— the best of beings, human & divine —
living beings pay homage —
to one gone
to the beyond
of becoming.

This is the difference:
It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.
Hiriottappasampannā,
sukkadhammasamāhitā;
Santo sappurisā loke,
devadhammāti vuccare.

https://suttacentral.net/ja6/en/chalmer ... ight=false
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Mumfie
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Mumfie »

SarathW wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:20 am Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?
Not just Sāriputta. Every Ariyan is “born from the mouth of the Blessed One (bhagavato mukhato jāto)”
“Vāsettha, all of you, though of different birth, name, clan and family, who have gone forth from the household life into homelessness, if you are asked who you are, should reply: ‘We are samaṇas, we are sons of the Sakyan.’

“He whose faith in the Tathāgata is settled, rooted, established, solid, unshakeable by any samaṇa or brāhmaṇa, any deva or māra or brahmā or anyone in the world, can truly say: ‘I am a true son of the Blessed One, born of his mouth, born of Dhamma, created by Dhamma, an heir of Dhamma.’”
Aggaññasutta, DN27.
“Hobgoblin, nor foul fiend,
Shall daunt his spirit;”
John Bunyan, Pilgrim’s Progress II)
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Johann
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Johann »

Ontheway wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:59 am
Johann wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:34 am
Ontheway wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 4:13 am

It is a metaphor. It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.

But Brahmins' idea of it is different from Buddha's and they take it literally.
So whats the different, good householder in Metaphor gross or refined? To do heir? Aren't good houesholder got birth by Brahma David NS like a like?

iti 100

This was said by the Blessed One, said by the Arahant, so I have heard: “I am a brahman, responsive to requests, open-handed, bearing my last body, an unsurpassed doctor & surgeon. You are my children, my sons, born from my mouth, born of the Dhamma, created by the Dhamma, heirs to the Dhamma, not heirs in material things.

“There are these two kinds of gifts: a gift of material things & a gift of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a gift of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of sharing: sharing of material things & sharing of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: sharing of the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of assistance: assistance with material things & assistance with the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: help with the Dhamma.

“There are these two kinds of mass-donations: a mass-donation of material things & a mass-donation of the Dhamma. Of the two, this is supreme: a mass-donation of the Dhamma.”



He who, unstinting,
made the mass-donation of Dhamma,
the Tathagata,
sympathetic to all beings:
to one of that sort
— the best of beings, human & divine —
living beings pay homage —
to one gone
to the beyond
of becoming.

This is the difference:
It is precisely because Sariputta was a student of Lord Buddha, learned the Dhamma uttered by Lord Buddha, become a Disciple of Lord Buddha.
Sure it's good to find refuge, lineage, for David NS and householder might not serve it, Nyom. But most of yours don't like to get in relation.
SarathW
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by SarathW »

Mumfie wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:08 am
SarathW wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:20 am Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?
Not just Sāriputta. Every Ariyan is “born from the mouth of the Blessed One (bhagavato mukhato jāto)”
“Vāsettha, all of you, though of different birth, name, clan and family, who have gone forth from the household life into homelessness, if you are asked who you are, should reply: ‘We are samaṇas, we are sons of the Sakyan.’

“He whose faith in the Tathāgata is settled, rooted, established, solid, unshakeable by any samaṇa or brāhmaṇa, any deva or māra or brahmā or anyone in the world, can truly say: ‘I am a true son of the Blessed One, born of his mouth, born of Dhamma, created by Dhamma, an heir of Dhamma.’”
Aggaññasutta, DN27.
Thanks.
What this implies?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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Mumfie
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Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by Mumfie »

SarathW wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:46 am What this implies?
The "birth" spoken of here is of the kind that the Angulimāla Sutta calls the "noble birth", ariyajāti.

This differs from the other four modes of generation in that it doesn't arise in dependence upon a womb or an egg or moisture or one's own kamma. Rather, it arises through dependence on the words that come from the mouth of a Tathāgata or a Tathāgata's disciple.
“Hobgoblin, nor foul fiend,
Shall daunt his spirit;”
John Bunyan, Pilgrim’s Progress II)
SarathW
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Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Did Buddha say that Sariputta was born out of his mouth?

Post by SarathW »

Mumfie wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:44 am
SarathW wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:46 am What this implies?
The "birth" spoken of here is of the kind that the Angulimāla Sutta calls the "noble birth", ariyajāti.

This differs from the other four modes of generation in that it doesn't arise in dependence upon a womb or an egg or moisture or one's own kamma. Rather, it arises through dependence on the words that come from the mouth of a Tathāgata or a Tathāgata's disciple.
:thanks:
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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