New Theravada Bhikkhuni Ordinations a Cause for Joy

[Lucas Oliveira]

New Theravada Bhikkhuni Ordinations a Cause for Joy

This year, the United Theravāda Bhikkhunī Saṅgha International, an organization based in Bodh Gaya, India, celebrated its first International Theravada Bhikkhuni Ordination. The ordination ceremony took place on 11-12 November in Bodh Gaya, in coordination with the Maha Bodhi Society of India. Holding the event there, they noted, was important as it is the site of the Buddha’s awakening.

At the ceremony, 31 new bhikkhunis were given full or higher ordination—this is distinguished from novice ordination, which has been maintained in Theravada countries including Myanmar and Sri Lanka. The new group of fully ordained nuns came from countries including Australia, India, Malaysia, Vietnam, and Thailand.

https://www.buddhistdoor.net/features/b ... e-for-joy/


From Brahmavihara Monastery & Retreat Centre 梵行寺禅林 Facebook

[Kamran]

Great to see! Thanks for sharing.

[SarathW]

Great to see! Thanks for sharing.

Hi Kamran
Good to see you back in the forum.

[Eko Care]

The Beginning of the End of the Sasana.

[santa100]

The Beginning of the End of the Sasana.

As long as they observe the Garudhammas, then the Sasana will be ok.

"Just as, Ananda, a man might build a dyke around a large reservoir as a precaution so that the water would not overflow, so too, as a precaution I have prescribed for bhikkhunis the eight principles of respect as things not to be transgressed as long as life lasts"

[1747] Mp (Ce): “By this he shows the following: ‘When a causeway is not built around a large reservoir, whatever water would have remained there if the causeway had first been built does not remain because there is no causeway. So too, these principles of respect have been prescribed in advance, before an incident has arisen, for the purpose of preventing transgression. If they had not been prescribed, then, because women have gone forth, the good Dhamma would have lasted five hundred years. But because they have been laid down in advance, it will continue another five hundred years and thus last for the thousand years originally stated.

[ssasny]

The Beginning of the End of the Sasana.

The revival of an old thread to threaten karmic retribution.

[Eko Care]

As long as they observe the Garudhammas, then the Sasana will be ok.

It is ok only under two conditions
1. If the Upasampada-Vinayakamma is valid
2. If Garudhammas are observed

Both are absent here.

[santa100]

Both are absent here.

Please prove why they're absent.

[Eko Care]

Both are absent here.

Please prove why they're absent.

The 6th Garudhamma rule phohibit Bhikkhuni Ordinations like modern ones.

Therefore both points (validity and Garudhamma) are absent in modern Bhikkhunis.

[Dan74]

Both are absent here.

Please prove why they're absent.

The 6th Garudhamma rule phohibit Bhikkhuni Ordinations like modern ones.

Therefore both points (validity and Garudhamma) are absent in modern Bhikkhunis.

It seems there is a precept against common sense that I have overlooked somehow.

[Radix]

It seems there is a precept against common sense that I have overlooked somehow.

Ordination is a privilege, not a right.

Ordination is about being accepted into a lineage of students that originates from the Buddha.

Ordination is not a meal ticket.

[santa100]

The 6th Garudhamma rule phohibit Bhikkhuni Ordinations like modern ones.

Therefore both points (validity and Garudhamma) are absent in modern Bhikkhunis.

Again, you have not proven why the 6th rule is not observed by those bhikkhunis. All you've done is claiming that modern bhikkhunis do not observe those rules without a single piece of evidence to back that up.

The Beginning of the End of the Sasana.

Claiming something as true without providing any solid evidence to back that up is false speech. So maybe it's you who's really the one responsible for the Beginning of the End of the Sasana, not those bhikkhunis.

[Dan74]

The 6th Garudhamma rule phohibit Bhikkhuni Ordinations like modern ones.

Therefore both points (validity and Garudhamma) are absent in modern Bhikkhunis.

Again, you have not proven why the 6th rule is not observed by those bhikkhunis. All you've done is claiming that modern bhikkhunis do not observe those rules without a single piece of evidence to back that up.

The Beginning of the End of the Sasana.

Claiming something as true without providing any solid evidence to back that up is false speech. So maybe it's you who's really the one responsible for the Beginning of the End of the Sasana, not those bhikkhunis.

i think the standard argument by traditionalists like our friend here and Ajahn Thannisaro is that according to Garudhamma, you need bikhunis to ordain bikhunis. So if their order becomes extinct, it cannot be revived. According to their interpretation, at least. Ajahn Analayo sees it differently.

[Eko Care]

Again, you have not proven why the 6th rule is not observed by those bhikkhunis. All you've done is claiming that modern bhikkhunis do not observe those rules without a single piece of evidence to back that up.

Read the 6th rule again.

Claiming something as true without providing any solid evidence to back that up is false speech.

No. It's not the definition of false speech.

So maybe it's you who's really the one responsible for the Beginning of the End of the Sasana, not those bhikkhunis.

Non sequitor.

i think the standard argument by traditionalists like our friend here and Ajahn Thannisaro is that according to Garudhamma, you need bikhunis to ordain bikhunis. So if their order becomes extinct, it cannot be revived.

Yes.

6th Garudhamma:
To a bhikkhuni, the integration within the sangha can be done only among both communities and after having observed the first six precepts without having committed any fault over the past two years prior to the integration.
https://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/garudhamma
(6. When, as a probationer, she has trained in the six rules (cha dhamma) for two years, she should seek higher ordination from both Orders.)

[DNS]

Correct, however there were bhikkhuni preceptors at the time when the Theravada bhikkhuni lineage was reinstated.

They used Dhamaguptaka nuns from Korea and China. They have an unbroken lineage going back to the Buddha.

No rule in the vinaya against that.

All the subsequent ordinations after that used the fully ordained Theravada bhikkhunis.