Exact process of remembering past lives

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lostitude
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Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by lostitude »

Hello,

I know there have been dozens of threads about past lives already, but those I searched do not really discuss the question I would like to ask: do Buddhist texts provide andy insight into how exactly past lives are remembered, when they are?
The current scientific view is that memories are stored in neural networks, and the fact that we don’t remember our first months of existence (because said networks were not yet functional), let alone past lives, seems to require an alternative explanation if we are to accept past lives accounts.

Thanks!
sunnat
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by sunnat »

Check out cellular memory

https://www.vitalityunleashed.com.au › cellular-memory-of-trauma
Cellular Memory of Trauma - Vitality Unleashed Psychology
Symptoms of pain and anxiety are actually located in the subconscious or unconscious - "cellular memory.". Cellular memory is the same as just "memory". Scientists like Dr. Bruce Lipton have added "cellular" because previously it was believed memories existed only in the brain. Now, they have found memories are in cells throughout ...
thepea
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by thepea »

lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:08 am Hello,

I know there have been dozens of threads about past lives already, but those I searched do not really discuss the question I would like to ask: do Buddhist texts provide andy insight into how exactly past lives are remembered, when they are?
The current scientific view is that memories are stored in neural networks, and the fact that we don’t remember our first months of existence (because said networks were not yet functional), let alone past lives, seems to require an alternative explanation if we are to accept past lives accounts.

Thanks!
Satipatthana sutta
Bundokji
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by Bundokji »

Remembering past lives is the first of the three knowledge (abhiññā). This type of knowledge is often described as "direct", which is more relevant to the recollection of the triple gem than going back in time through breaking the barrier of birth or the present.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
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confusedlayman
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by confusedlayman »

I think its similar to how you remember anything of past in this very life
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
lostitude
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by lostitude »

sunnat wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:16 am Check out cellular memory

https://www.vitalityunleashed.com.au › cellular-memory-of-trauma
Cellular Memory of Trauma - Vitality Unleashed Psychology
Symptoms of pain and anxiety are actually located in the subconscious or unconscious - "cellular memory.". Cellular memory is the same as just "memory". Scientists like Dr. Bruce Lipton have added "cellular" because previously it was believed memories existed only in the brain. Now, they have found memories are in cells throughout ...
Thanks, but I’ve read the article and:
"Biologist Dr Bruce Lipton explains..."
"each cell has its own consciousness, each cell is connected to the Universal field of energy..."
"This is the Quantum reality of our bodies..."
"This is called Quantum Physics."

Frankly this is about as compelling as the story of Eve being created from Adam’s rib...

thepea wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:23 am
lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:08 am Hello,

I know there have been dozens of threads about past lives already, but those I searched do not really discuss the question I would like to ask: do Buddhist texts provide andy insight into how exactly past lives are remembered, when they are?
The current scientific view is that memories are stored in neural networks, and the fact that we don’t remember our first months of existence (because said networks were not yet functional), let alone past lives, seems to require an alternative explanation if we are to accept past lives accounts.

Thanks!
Satipatthana sutta
Thanks. Could you be more specific please? I’ve looked it up and haven’t found anything related to memory/past lives, but this is quite a long text.
Bundokji wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:54 am Remembering past lives is the first of the three knowledge (abhiññā). This type of knowledge is often described as "direct", which is more relevant to the recollection of the triple gem than going back in time through breaking the barrier of birth or the present.
I see. But is there any explanation in the scriptures of how this is at all possible?
confusedlayman wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:34 am I think its similar to how you remember anything of past in this very life
Well as I was pointing out, you don’t even remember your infanthood in this very life, and that’s because your brain isn’t mature enough to properly encode data into your long-term episodic memory. So that would apply even more to anything that supposedly happened before your birth, i.e. when your brain was non-existent. Unless ’how you remember anything in this very life’ relies on an entirely different process than the once described scientifically.
thepea
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by thepea »

lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:34 am
sunnat wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:16 am Check out cellular memory

https://www.vitalityunleashed.com.au › cellular-memory-of-trauma
Cellular Memory of Trauma - Vitality Unleashed Psychology
Symptoms of pain and anxiety are actually located in the subconscious or unconscious - "cellular memory.". Cellular memory is the same as just "memory". Scientists like Dr. Bruce Lipton have added "cellular" because previously it was believed memories existed only in the brain. Now, they have found memories are in cells throughout ...
Thanks, but I’ve read the article and:
"Biologist Dr Bruce Lipton explains..."
"each cell has its own consciousness, each cell is connected to the Universal field of energy..."
"This is the Quantum reality of our bodies..."
"This is called Quantum Physics."

Frankly this is about as compelling as the story of Eve being created from Adam’s rib...

thepea wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:23 am
lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:08 am Hello,

I know there have been dozens of threads about past lives already, but those I searched do not really discuss the question I would like to ask: do Buddhist texts provide andy insight into how exactly past lives are remembered, when they are?
The current scientific view is that memories are stored in neural networks, and the fact that we don’t remember our first months of existence (because said networks were not yet functional), let alone past lives, seems to require an alternative explanation if we are to accept past lives accounts.

Thanks!
Satipatthana sutta
Thanks. Could you be more specific please? I’ve looked it up and haven’t found anything related to memory/past lives, but this is quite a long text.
Bundokji wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:54 am Remembering past lives is the first of the three knowledge (abhiññā). This type of knowledge is often described as "direct", which is more relevant to the recollection of the triple gem than going back in time through breaking the barrier of birth or the present.
I see. But is there any explanation in the scriptures of how this is at all possible?
confusedlayman wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:34 am I think its similar to how you remember anything of past in this very life
Well as I was pointing out, you don’t even remember your infanthood in this very life, and that’s because your brain isn’t mature enough to properly encode data into your long-term episodic memory. So that would apply even more to anything that supposedly happened before your birth, i.e. when your brain was non-existent. Unless ’how you remember anything in this very life’ relies on an entirely different process than the once described scientifically.
Sati is literally memory or remembering. Develop in sati. This is buddhas teachings.
Bundokji
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by Bundokji »

lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:34 am I see. But is there any explanation in the scriptures of how this is at all possible?
There is a description in MN19 of how the Buddha attained the first knowledge:
"When the mind was thus concentrated, purified, bright, unblemished, rid of defilement, pliant, malleable, steady, & attained to imperturbability, I directed it to the knowledge of recollecting my past lives. I recollected my manifold past lives, i.e., one birth, two... five, ten... fifty, a hundred, a thousand, a hundred thousand, many eons of cosmic contraction, many eons of cosmic expansion, many eons of cosmic contraction & expansion: 'There I had such a name, belonged to such a clan, had such an appearance. Such was my food, such my experience of pleasure & pain, such the end of my life. Passing away from that state, I re-arose there. There too I had such a name, belonged to such a clan, had such an appearance. Such was my food, such my experience of pleasure & pain, such the end of my life. Passing away from that state, I re-arose here.' Thus I remembered my manifold past lives in their modes & details.
There are suttas that explain the sixfold recollection such as AN 11.13:

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
lostitude
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by lostitude »

thepea wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:40 am Sati is literally memory or remembering. Develop in sati. This is buddhas teachings.
Right, but this doesn’t seem to refer here to remembering something that happened in the past. Again, I’ve scanned the whole text and haven’t found any reference to episodic memory of the kind that could explain memories from past lives. Did I look in the wrong place?
Bundokji wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:35 pm There is a description in MN19 of how the Buddha attained the first knowledge:
"When the mind was thus concentrated, purified, bright, unblemished, rid of defilement, pliant, malleable, steady, & attained to imperturbability, I directed it to the knowledge of recollecting my past lives. I recollected my manifold past lives,
That’s not much to go on. So basically the scriptures say that Buddha accessed such memories but there is no theoretical model as to how this is possible, right?
Thanks!
Bundokji
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by Bundokji »

lostitude wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:13 am Right, but this doesn’t seem to refer here to remembering something that happened in the past. Again, I’ve scanned the whole text and haven’t found any reference to episodic memory of the kind that could explain memories from past lives. Did I look in the wrong place?
DN1 mentions such abilities by other ascetics, but they are not linked to liberation or to the noble path. There is a video by Ven. Yuttadhammo about this if of interest to you:



That’s not much to go on. So basically the scriptures say that Buddha accessed such memories but there is no theoretical model as to how this is possible, right?
I guess remembering past lives was well known by ascetics during the Buddha's time, hence there is no detailed explanations about it in the suttas. For example, the jhanas were practiced by other sects, which represent a supramundane knowledge that is not accessible to ordinary people. The focus on the lineage or clan in how the Buddha remembered his past lives might indicate that certain aspects of his teachings are restricted to people he identified upon his encounter with Brhama Sahampati, referred to through translations as "people with little dust in their eyes". The divine eye, which is the second knowledge could be accessible to other ascetics, but not the third which is restricted to ariyas. Presenting the three knowledge through this sequence indicates that remembering past lives is not an end in itself. Ariyas might be capable to figuring it out, without detailed explanations in the suttas. There could be a lot of cosmic checks and balances to be taken into account.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
thepea
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by thepea »

Bundokji wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:39 am
lostitude wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 11:13 am Right, but this doesn’t seem to refer here to remembering something that happened in the past. Again, I’ve scanned the whole text and haven’t found any reference to episodic memory of the kind that could explain memories from past lives. Did I look in the wrong place?
DN1 mentions such abilities by other ascetics, but they are not linked to liberation or to the noble path. There is a video by Ven. Yuttadhammo about this if of interest to you:



That’s not much to go on. So basically the scriptures say that Buddha accessed such memories but there is no theoretical model as to how this is possible, right?
I guess remembering past lives was well known by ascetics during the Buddha's time, hence there is no detailed explanations about it in the suttas. For example, the jhanas were practiced by other sects, which represent a supramundane knowledge that is not accessible to ordinary people. The focus on the lineage or clan in how the Buddha remembered his past lives might indicate that certain aspects of his teachings are restricted to people he identified upon his encounter with Brhama Sahampati, referred to through translations as "people with little dust in their eyes". The divine eye, which is the second knowledge could be accessible to other ascetics, but not the third which is restricted to ariyas. Presenting the three knowledge through this sequence indicates that remembering past lives is not an end in itself. Ariyas might be capable to figuring it out, without detailed explanations in the suttas. There could be a lot of cosmic checks and balances to be taken into account.
What else can you remember but past?
The awareness of remembering is being present.
Bundokji
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by Bundokji »

thepea wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 4:27 pm What else can you remember but past?
The awareness of remembering is being present.
The six qualities of the dhamma seem to be all present, but Ariyas are said to not mix up the three pathways of language. I think the three pathways of language can be mixed when they are thought of as having the same root/origin, such as reacting to a painful memory in the present. It is not clear what the Buddha was referring to when he gave a linguistic account of his past lives.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by cappuccino »

lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:08 am do Buddhist texts provide andy insight into how exactly past lives are remembered, when they are?
You have to develop your concentration
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zerotime
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by zerotime »

lostitude wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:08 am The current scientific view is that memories are stored in neural networks, and the fact that we don’t remember our first months of existence (because said networks were not yet functional), let alone past lives, seems to require an alternative explanation if we are to accept past lives accounts.
note this is a complete absurdity. A neuron is just a cell working like a cable to transmit 0.75mv. How it can have the images from the past?. Where are the images of your old friends, your places and thousand different memories?. Maybe into the mitochondrias?

Be careful with Pop-Science. This is a endless source of incoherences and wrong beliefs, promoted by this failed system for the new zombified masses. Because today the people is emptied of Spirit and transcendental meaning for their own lives. And this failed system of the God-Money should promote the ridicule pop-science like a new coarse pseudo-religion, in where eventually the masses should take the new communion with all sort of drugs and harmful behaviors and ideas, to palliate the pains of their existential prison.

The process of remembering past lives is a supranormal skill normally arising in an very high progress. The method is related in DN 2:

https://accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn ... .than.html
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Pondera
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Re: Exact process of remembering past lives

Post by Pondera »

First step is buying into the theory that memories are retained in some metaphysical way outside the body.

After that you just look up and climb the ladder.

Eventually you arrive in the womb and at the very moment of consciousness linking, when your consciousness in the bardo descends into the womb.

If you follow the trail even father up, you arrive at the death moment of your previous life.

Then, you can trace it all the way back to your birth.

Finally, you stop the ascent upwards and back in time, and the whole thing plays out, with all the memories of that life - up until the present moment.

No, there is no explanation in the texts. Maybe somewhere in Abhidhamma.

But, I happen to know the meaning of this translation.

“Reaching up to such rapture of heart, that rapt in heart he recollects his past life, five past lives …”

The hint is “reaching up”. There is a literal tube that we are falling through. It’s your existential being falling through time. As Heidegger stated it so well, “Dasein is falling.”

As we fall, every memory is stamped onto reality.

As I said, first step is buying into this kind of yammer.
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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