Moses and Mara

[Mahabrahma]

Here is the actual text:

Heavenly beings, dragons, yakshas,
rakshasas and pishachas
likewise with rejoicing minds
will constantly delight in coming to bring alms.
The heavenly king Brahma, the devil king,
the deities Freedom and Great Freedom,
all the multitude of heavenly beings
will constantly come to where he is.

A devil king is not mara, it simply means someone who rules over devils, be the devil king in question good or bad. And mara himself has no capacity to rule. You should know this.

[Bundokji]

Here is the actual text:

Heavenly beings, dragons, yakshas,
rakshasas and pishachas
likewise with rejoicing minds
will constantly delight in coming to bring alms.
The heavenly king Brahma, the devil king,
the deities Freedom and Great Freedom,
all the multitude of heavenly beings
will constantly come to where he is.

A devil king is not mara, it simply means someone who rules over devils, be the devil king in question good or bad. And mara himself has no capacity to rule. You should know this.

“Bhikkhus, (1) on the eighth of the fortnight, the ministers and assembly members of the four great kings wander over this world, thinking: ‘We hope there are many people who behave properly toward their mother and father, behave properly toward ascetics and brahmins, honor the elders of the family, observe the uposatha, keep the extra observance days, and do meritorious deeds.’ (2) On the fourteenth of the fortnight, the sons of the four great kings wander over this world, thinking: ‘We hope there are many people who behave properly toward their mother and father … … and do meritorious deeds.’ (3) On the fifteenth, the uposatha day, the four great kings themselves wander over this world, thinking: ‘We hope there are many people who behave properly toward their mother and father … and do meritorious deeds.’

“If, bhikkhus, there are few people who behave properly toward their mother and father … and do meritorious deeds, the four great kings report this to the Tāvatiṁsa devas when they meet and are sitting together in the Sudhamma council hall: ‘Revered sirs, there are few people who behave properly toward their mother and father … and do meritorious deeds.’ Then, because of this, the Tāvatiṁsa devas become displeased, saying: ‘Alas, the celestial company will decline and the company of asuras will flourish!’

“But if there are many people who behave properly toward their mother and father … and do meritorious deeds, the four great kings report this to the Tāvatiṁsa devas when they meet and are sitting together in the Sudhamma council hall: ‘Revered sirs, there are many people who behave properly toward their mother and father, behave properly toward ascetics and brahmins, honor the elders of the family, observe the uposatha, keep the extra observance days, and do meritorious deeds.’ Then, because of this, the Tāvatiṁsa devas become elated, saying: ‘Indeed, the celestial company will flourish and the company of asuras will decline!’”

Do not you think the above presents a case of child abuse? Do you believe the four great kings to be deities or not?

[Mahabrahma]

Mara is not among them.

[Bundokji]

Mara is not among them.

I asked a specific question relevant to your criterion about child abuse to determine who is a deity and who is not. It is up to you to provide a straightforward answer or not.

[Mahabrahma]

How about you think for yourself.

[Bundokji]

How about you think for yourself.

Engaging with others and thinking for oneself are not mutually exclusive. No need to be defensive.

[Coëmgenu]

Here is the actual text:

Heavenly beings, dragons, yakshas,
rakshasas and pishachas
likewise with rejoicing minds
will constantly delight in coming to bring alms.
The heavenly king Brahma, the devil king,
the deities Freedom and Great Freedom,
all the multitude of heavenly beings
will constantly come to where he is.

A devil king is not mara, it simply means someone who rules over devils, be the devil king in question good or bad. And mara himself has no capacity to rule. You should know this.

My translation is correct. Look at the Chinese....

[Mahabrahma]

I'll leave you guys to it. You will all become Enlightened one day just as the Buddha says!

[Bundokji]

It happened that Moses had his miracle against a group of magicians, turning his staff into a snake. Snakes have been used by Abrahamics and Buddhists alike to represent different set of values through the use of hierarchical structures.

The serpent (Mara) deceived Adam and Eve to eat from the forbidden fruit, causing their decent to earth. On earth, what constitutes a "being" is both animals and animals, of which Nagas are said to be half humans and half serpents. It happened that humans are distinctive by a sense of alienation through knowledge of their own mortality, and a longing to go back to their original home, that is heaven.

So, humans should rid themselves from the deception that caused them to descend to earth, where each sect has its own "staff" that can magically deceive them into believing in falsehood, and sending them either to hell or to the animal womb (by acting like animals).

Another parallel between Buddhism and Abrahamic religions is the role of a serpent as a protector. In Buddhism, Nagas are said to be protective of treasures, hence the Buddhist alignment with heterodoxy in general. This act of protection, in Buddhist cosmological framework, is demonstrated by placing Mara (or Moses) in the sixth sensual heaven, as a gate keeper. In the suttas, he is protective of his master Baka, where he still visits his assembly occasionally. What makes Baka a Maha Brahama is that Maras influence cannot go beyond him, not being aware of the higher Jhanas that lies beyond.

[Ontheway]

Just imagine only.

I think the so-called "God" in Bible is just an angry Asura. Considering this Biblical "God" is a "jealous God", in habit of uttering falsehood (said himself is a loving entity but turn out to be a violent one), unforgiving and vengeful.

The fallen angel aka Lucifer maybe just a Devata fallen from Tavatimsa and therefore another Asura. But due to Asura clan conflicts, Lucifer and "God" are antagonizing each other.

Biblical angels are like low ranked Asurakaya... entities with deformed bizarre bodies.

Or the caucasian angels depicting with wings in arts, are just kinnaris and kinnaras. Saint Michael most probably just a male kinnara or Garuda with troops.

The serpent aka leviathan is just an ordinary sea Naga.

[Bundokji]

Just imagine only.

I think the so-called "God" in Bible is just an angry Asura. Considering this Biblical "God" is a "jealous God", in habit of uttering falsehood (said himself is a loving entity but turn out to be a violent one), unforgiving and vengeful.

The fallen angel aka Lucifer maybe just a Devata fallen from Tavatimsa and therefore another Asura. But due to Asura clan conflicts, Lucifer and "God" are antagonizing each other.

Biblical angels are like low ranked Asurakaya... entities with deformed bizarre bodies.

Or the caucasian angels depicting with wings in arts, are just kinnaris and kinnaras. Saint Michael most probably just a male kinnara or Garuda with troops.

The serpent aka leviathan is just an ordinary sea Naga.

A more forgiving interpretation would view god as a psychological phenomena, where love can easily turn into jealousy and vengeance. The interesting part is not how a creator represents itself in terms of self view, but how it manifests itself collectively.

Collectively, Abrahamics chose Jerusalem as a place for a final showdown to sort out the subsequent sectarianism of believing in god, so god seems to penetrate more deeply in the fabric of "reality" than what the ordinary perception can tell us about the world. What makes the whole thing more interesting or strange is that these people are not stupid, but as if they were hijacked or compelled to act upon some biblical prophecy.

As to the relationship to "truth" and "sectarianism", the Buddhist answer is not straightforward. The simile of the snake, or what Nagas came to represent, implies that not taking sides is not necessarily the best option. The story of Moses tells us that his staff is yet another magic trick, capable of swallowing the snakes of other magicians. The twin miracles Buddhas perform implies that the same nonsense has been happening repeatedly. I guess one benefit of remembering past lives is to know what side to take, if any, when this nonsense repeats itself as a historical event.