Cults and Religions

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
SarathW
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by SarathW »

Does Woke means a cult?
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TRobinson465
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by TRobinson465 »

SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:41 am Does Woke means a cult?
Woke social justice warriors have become cult-like in some ways yes. Similar to the political cult of Trump in the US. Blind partisan support for one ideology. Being "woke" doesnt mean you automatically have this cult-like attribute but many wokesters do have a cult mindset and literally think that affirmative action for minorities is like more important than solving homelessness in the US.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism" - the 14th Dalai Lama

"The Blessed One has set in motion the unexcelled Wheel of Dhamma that cannot be stopped by brahmins, devas, Maras, Brahmas or anyone in the cosmos." -Dhammacakkappavattana Sutta
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Coëmgenu »

Ceisiwr wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 2:10 pm[...] in understanding how someone could be so committed to something so far out that they go as far as killing themselves for it.
From my limited exposure to the emerging facts around the event, I understand it to be something of an infamous myth that most members drank the Kool-Aid willingly, if at all. Once people started dying of the Kool-Aid, others started panicking. A great deal of them were shot by "True Believers" who then went on to drink the Kool-Aid themselves, unless I'm quite mistaken.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Ceisiwr »

Coëmgenu wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 4:29 am
Ceisiwr wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 2:10 pm[...] in understanding how someone could be so committed to something so far out that they go as far as killing themselves for it.
From my limited exposure to the emerging facts around the event, I understand it to be something of an infamous myth that most members drank the Kool-Aid willingly, if at all. Once people started dying of the Kool-Aid, others started panicking. A great deal of them were shot by "True Believers" who then went on to drink the Kool-Aid themselves, unless I'm quite mistaken.
I think you’re thinking of Jim Jones and his cult. With Heaven’s Gate they all went willingly. When you watch their “exit videos”, just days before they were “beamed up” to a spaceship that would take them to the “Next Evolutionary Level Above Humans”, or read their farewell statements on their (still running) website, you can tell that they really did believe in it all. They really felt that by killing their “human vehicle” their soul would be released and they would ascend. Before all that they spent a great deal of time attempting to strip themselves of all desires, of anything that made them human, over years and years so they could ascend (some went as far as castrating themselves)

“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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cappuccino
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by cappuccino »

people are bored out of their minds


cults are kind of interesting

:shrug:
SarathW
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by SarathW »

I think many humans are cult oriented.
They are either followers of a cult or like to be a leader of a cult. :D

As you know I watch a lot of Youtube videos.
What I have seen is when you like a particular Youtuber, his followers basically worship them.
They never question the presenter.
I have seen this in political campaigns or even in your favorite football team or your favorite monk.
People accept them unequivocally.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Justsit
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Justsit »

SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:41 am Does Woke means a cult?
No, it does not meet the criteria listed in the earlier post by DNS.
There is no leader, no rules that must be followed, no mind altering practices, no isolation, etc.

"Woke" can be a verb or an adjective, per Dictionary.com, and is often used in a disparaging manner to describe persons who adhere to certain political beliefs.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/woke
SarathW
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by SarathW »

Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 2:02 pm
SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:41 am Does Woke means a cult?
No, it does not meet the criteria listed in the earlier post by DNS.
There is no leader, no rules that must be followed, no mind altering practices, no isolation, etc.

"Woke" can be a verb or an adjective, per Dictionary.com, and is often used in a disparaging manner to describe persons who adhere to certain political beliefs.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/woke
Perhaps the so-called Woke groups might have the characteristics of a cult.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Justsit
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Justsit »

SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:18 pm
Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 2:02 pm
SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:41 am Does Woke means a cult?
No, it does not meet the criteria listed in the earlier post by DNS.
There is no leader, no rules that must be followed, no mind altering practices, no isolation, etc.

"Woke" can be a verb or an adjective, per Dictionary.com, and is often used in a disparaging manner to describe persons who adhere to certain political beliefs.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/woke
Perhaps the so-called Woke groups might have the characteristics of a cult.
I'm not sure what you mean by a "Woke Group?" Can you give an example?
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retrofuturist
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,
Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:34 pm I'm not sure what you mean by a "Woke Group?" Can you give an example?
I believe he's referring to the left-wing identitarian movement that has arisen over the past decade or so.

See: Identity Politics

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Paul. :)
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Radix
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Radix »

Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:34 pmI'm not sure what you mean by a "Woke Group?" Can you give an example?
Ever met a woke person? They are totally like cultists: driven, obsessive, authoritarian, black-and-white, all-or-nothing thinking. Even if they have no leader, they behave as if they had one. They certainly have rules that must be followed, even if they don't always state them openly. They isolate themselves, draw sharp lines between themselves and others. As for mind altering practices: I guess the adrenaline, cortisole, and dopamine rushes they get from their self-righteousness function like "mind altering practices".
Western Buddhism is the perfect ideological supplement to rabid consumerist capitalism.
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SarathW
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by SarathW »

Radix wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 8:53 pm
Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:34 pmI'm not sure what you mean by a "Woke Group?" Can you give an example?
Ever met a woke person? They are totally like cultists: driven, obsessive, authoritarian, black-and-white, all-or-nothing thinking. Even if they have no leader, they behave as if they had one. They certainly have rules that must be followed, even if they don't always state them openly. They isolate themselves, draw sharp lines between themselves and others. As for mind altering practices: I guess the adrenaline, cortisole, and dopamine rushes they get from their self-righteousness function like "mind altering practices".
How can a movent run without a leader?
This is a very strong lobby group with some support and leadership.
:thinking:
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Justsit
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Justsit »

SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 10:03 pm
Radix wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 8:53 pm
Justsit wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:34 pmI'm not sure what you mean by a "Woke Group?" Can you give an example?
Ever met a woke person? They are totally like cultists: driven, obsessive, authoritarian, black-and-white, all-or-nothing thinking. Even if they have no leader, they behave as if they had one. They certainly have rules that must be followed, even if they don't always state them openly. They isolate themselves, draw sharp lines between themselves and others. As for mind altering practices: I guess the adrenaline, cortisole, and dopamine rushes they get from their self-righteousness function like "mind altering practices".
How can a movent run without a leader?
This is a very strong lobby group with some support and leadership.
:thinking:
There is no single lobby group involved. There are any number of groups with individual interests and agendas and different leaders. That, to me, does not meet the definition of "A cult", if that's what we are still discussing.
TRobinson465
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by TRobinson465 »

Justsit wrote: Thu Mar 30, 2023 12:27 am
There is no single lobby group involved. There are any number of groups with individual interests and agendas and different leaders. That, to me, does not meet the definition of "A cult", if that's what we are still discussing.
Yes the main issue is cult is extremely vague. By some definitions almost every religion is a cult. by others, only a few small fringe groups.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism" - the 14th Dalai Lama

"The Blessed One has set in motion the unexcelled Wheel of Dhamma that cannot be stopped by brahmins, devas, Maras, Brahmas or anyone in the cosmos." -Dhammacakkappavattana Sutta
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Radix
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Re: Cults and Religions

Post by Radix »

SarathW wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 10:03 pmHow can a movent run without a leader?
People often organize themselves around ideas. There needn't be an explicit leader, an ideology suffices.
Western Buddhism is the perfect ideological supplement to rabid consumerist capitalism.
Glenn Wallis
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