I think they all are dualities.
Perhaps the following discussion on Majja Sutta may be some help.
viewtopic.php?t=45180&hilit=majja+sutta
I think they all are dualities.
This diversity in perception and body makes the resolution of any conflicts to be attributed to dualities, and the urge into dissolving them into one (Maha-Brahama/Baka). In the corporeal body of the individual human, it manifests as some kind of symmetry unified into one bag of skin (two merged into one), and under the skin, things are not as symmetrical as they appear to be (bodily organs), so the world of appearances (which are assumed to be deceptive) and the world beyond becomes another regularity for the human - hence the quality of the truth under such conditions is non-divisible (either/ or), and it can be either exoteric (the order of two/one/two/one ad infinitum) or esoteric (the chaos that lies beneath or beyond/the jungle where monks dwell).There are sentient beings that are diverse in body and diverse in perception, such as human beings, some gods, and some beings in the underworld. This is the first abode of sentient beings.
Extremes are simple and easy. The middle way is complex and difficult.
There comes a time when, Vāseṭṭha, after a very long period has passed, this cosmos contracts. Here begins the story of origins. The Buddha begins his creation myth with the end of the world. For this passage, compare DN 1:2.2.1.As the cosmos contracts, sentient beings are mostly headed for the realm of streaming radiance. There they are mind-made, feeding on rapture, self-luminous, moving through the sky, steadily glorious, and they remain like that for a very long time.
There comes a time when, after a very long period has passed, this cosmos expands. As the cosmos expands, sentient beings mostly pass away from that host of radiant deities and come back to this realm. In the Brahmajālasutta, beings pass from one Brahmā realm to another, but when they come to this world it is as a human. Here we have a different perspective, where beings apparently still like the Brahmā gods exist in the physical realm.Here they are mind-made, feeding on rapture, self-luminous, moving through the sky, steadily glorious, and they remain like that for a very long time. The role of food is critical throughout this narrative. Food is a fundamental sustenance on which all creatures must rely, and the nature of the food reflects the type of creature that eats it. Taittirīya Upaniṣad 2.5.1 says the highest form of self is made of bliss (ātmā ānandamaya).
2. The Earth’s Nectar Appears
But the single mass of water at that time was utterly dark. Creation myths often begin with a dark, formless world of water, and describe the emergence of divisions and structures of the world. They do not differentiate the physical, biological, ecological, or social, as such distinctions came later.The moon and sun were not found, nor were stars and constellations, day and night, months and fortnights, years and seasons, or male and female. Beings were simply known as ‘beings’. Throughout, the discourse has a special interest in tracing the origins of language and how different usages came about. Here the term “beings” is presented as a natural choice: they are “beings” because they are alive. Later, words are selected to convey a certain political or moral stance.After a very long period had passed, the earth’s nectar curdled in the water. The reading and sense of samatani is obscure. I think it is connected with santānaka in the next line, in the sense of “networks” or tendrils appearing in the water as it curdles. The Sanskrit at SF 277 and Mūlasarvāstvāda Vinaya 17 has saṁmūrcchitaḥ saṁtanoti (“curdled tendrils”). | Rasapathavī (“earth’s nectar”) is also obscure. We would expect pathavīrasa (cp. phalarasa “fruit juice”, etc.), which is indeed found at SN 5.9:5.3 in the sense “nutriments in soil”. Since this reading also appears here in the Sanskrit sources, I assume it is the correct sense.It appeared just like the curd on top of hot milk-rice as it cools. It was beautiful, fragrant, and delicious, like ghee or butter. And it was as sweet as pure dwarf-bee honey. Khuddā (literally “small one”) is said to be a species of small bee, also known in Sanskrit as kṣudrā. The “dwarf bee” (apis florea) fits the bill, as it is a small wild honeybee found in India.Now, one of those beings was reckless. Thinking, ‘Oh my, what might this be?’ they tasted the earth’s nectar with their finger. Ghee and honey were among the finest offerings to the gods. The soma was often described as “honeyed”. Our text is suggesting that the Vedic sacrifices led to the corruption of divinity.They enjoyed it, and craving was born in them. For acchadesi read assādesi (“enjoyed”) after Mu Kd 17’s āsvādayati. The commentary explains acchadesi as “becomes suffused”, so if it is a misreading it is an old one.And other beings, following that being’s example, tasted the earth’s nectar with their fingers. They too enjoyed it, and craving was born in
3. The Moon and Sun Appear
Then those beings started to eat the earth’s nectar, breaking it into lumps. But when they did this their luminosity vanished. And with the vanishing of their luminosity the moon and sun appeared, stars and constellations appeared, days and nights were distinguished, and so were months and fortnights, and years and seasons. So far had the world evolved once more.
Then those beings eating the earth’s nectar, with that as their food and nourishment, remained for a very long time. But so long as they ate that earth’s nectar, their bodies became more solid and they diverged in appearance; some beautiful, some ugly. And the beautiful beings looked down on the ugly ones: At DN 26:17.2 it is the ugly ones who are at fault for jealousy.‘We’re more beautiful, they’re the ugly ones!’ And the vanity of the beautiful ones made the earth’s nectar vanish. They gathered together and bemoaned, ‘Oh, what a taste! Oh, what a taste!’ And even today when people get something tasty they say: ‘Oh, what a taste! Oh, what a taste!’ They’re just remembering an ancient primordial saying, but they don’t understand what it means. This is another veiled critique of the Vedic tradition. In DN 13:13.1 the Buddha told Vāseṭṭha and Bhāradvāja the Vedas were recited by people who did not understand them. This problem was well understood within the tradition of the Brāhmaṇas and Upaniṣads, which constantly emphasized that they are effective for “one who knows this” (ya evam veda).
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7. Gender Appears
But so long as they ate that ripe untilled rice, their bodies became more solid and they diverged in appearance. And female characteristics appeared on women, while male characteristics appeared on men. The commentary to Bu Pj 1:10.6.1 explains “male characteristics” as “beard and whiskers, etc.” (massudāṭhikādi), so this is not just genitals but also secondary sex characteristics.Women spent too much time gazing at men, and men at women. They became lustful, and their bodies burned with fever. Due to this fever they had sex with each other.
The Origin of the World
Aggaññasutta
DN 27
https://suttacentral.net/dn27/en/sujato ... ript=latin
Delusion / ignorance ….. not seeing and knowing the 4NT, the illusion itself.
No ….. to transcend them.It appears Buddha's main teaching is to break these two extremes.
All part of existence ….. bounded within.The question is why humans are naturally inclined to two extremes?
Samsara (trapped, conditioned) v Nibbana (freedom, unconditioned) ….. delusion / ignorance v unborn.What is the link between extremes and Nibbana?
There are always someone more extreme than you are, either good or bad ….. not an issue here.How do I know that I am in an extreme?
To not exist / born ….. by Direct knowledge of 4NT.How do I escape from the extreme?
This is such apegembara wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 2:07 am Measuring or comparing.
To be rich, there have to be poor, tall-short, dead-alive, black-white, good-evil, us-them, inside-outside,
heaven-hell, samsara-nibbana...
All these are concepts that we put over our experiences of the world to make sense of an indescribable reality.
Notice that most of these concepts relate to physical things, especially with regard to our bodies.
Without attachment to the body, rich/poor, healthy/sick, dead/alive, old/young, black/white, male/female has no relevance.
In other words, aging, sickness, and death don't apply. Unwholesome speech and deeds also don't apply.
From the view point of a Russian scientist w
Book: Seeing with the Eye of Dhamma: The Comprehensive Teaching of Buddhadasa BhikkhuWhy humans are stuck in duality?
The duality in our life is a very strange phenomenon.
black-white, male-female, good-bad, day-night, loss-gain, long-short, high-low, existence-nonexistence and minimalist living-luxury living is naming a few.
It appears Buddha's main teaching is to break these two extremes.
I think it's primarily about control.
Perhaps this is due to the human tendency to clinging to views.Radix wrote: ↑Mon May 29, 2023 6:37 pmI think it's primarily about control.
I would't call it "stuck" in duality, but, rather, preferring duality. To think in black and white terms, to set the number of options and to define them: these are expressions of the will to control. If anything, humans want control. And how better to achieve a sense of it than by defining the bare minimum (ie. 2) of options that get to be regarded as "the only 2 realistic ones".
It sounds a bit like the allegorical fall from the Garden of Eden and the beginning of suffering from birth, sickness, and death and the journey to return to Eden. The forbidden tree of 'knowledge' is more like the tree of delusion/ignorance. Having eaten the fruit they gained 'awareness of good and evil' which is a duality. The loss of 'innocence' is the cause of greed, hatred, and delusion.acessoaoinsight wrote: ↑Sun May 28, 2023 10:12 pm These three stages represent the whole story of Buddhism concisely: pristine mind then foolish mind and then liberated mind. If you thoroughly understand these stages, you have understood all of Buddhism."
The story behind Adam and Eve is that they were the first human couple created by God and placed in the Garden of Eden. They were allowed to eat from any tree in the garden except for the "tree of knowledge" of good and evil. However, they were tempted by a serpent to eat from the forbidden tree, and as a result, they gained the awareness of good and evil, but also lost their innocence and harmony with God. They were then banished from the garden and had to face the hardships of life.
If this what Buddhadasa teaches it is not Buddhism.pegembara wrote: ↑Tue May 30, 2023 1:56 amIt sounds a bit like the allegorical fall from the Garden of Eden and the beginning of suffering from birth, sickness, and death and the journey to return to Eden. The forbidden tree of 'knowledge' is more like the tree of delusion/ignorance. Having eaten the fruit they gained 'awareness of good and evil' which is a duality. The loss of 'innocence' is the cause of greed, hatred, and delusion.acessoaoinsight wrote: ↑Sun May 28, 2023 10:12 pm These three stages represent the whole story of Buddhism concisely: pristine mind then foolish mind and then liberated mind. If you thoroughly understand these stages, you have understood all of Buddhism."
The story behind Adam and Eve is that they were the first human couple created by God and placed in the Garden of Eden. They were allowed to eat from any tree in the garden except for the "tree of knowledge" of good and evil. However, they were tempted by a serpent to eat from the forbidden tree, and as a result, they gained the awareness of good and evil, but also lost their innocence and harmony with God. They were then banished from the garden and had to face the hardships of life.
I have read Buddhadasa and quite enjoy them -don't know if they are his actual thoughts or a translation by his students.SarathW wrote: ↑Tue May 30, 2023 2:45 amIf this what Buddhadasa teaches it is not Buddhism.pegembara wrote: ↑Tue May 30, 2023 1:56 amIt sounds a bit like the allegorical fall from the Garden of Eden and the beginning of suffering from birth, sickness, and death and the journey to return to Eden. The forbidden tree of 'knowledge' is more like the tree of delusion/ignorance. Having eaten the fruit they gained 'awareness of good and evil' which is a duality. The loss of 'innocence' is the cause of greed, hatred, and delusion.acessoaoinsight wrote: ↑Sun May 28, 2023 10:12 pm These three stages represent the whole story of Buddhism concisely: pristine mind then foolish mind and then liberated mind. If you thoroughly understand these stages, you have understood all of Buddhism."
The story behind Adam and Eve is that they were the first human couple created by God and placed in the Garden of Eden. They were allowed to eat from any tree in the garden except for the "tree of knowledge" of good and evil. However, they were tempted by a serpent to eat from the forbidden tree, and as a result, they gained the awareness of good and evil, but also lost their innocence and harmony with God. They were then banished from the garden and had to face the hardships of life.
Perhaps he is teaching Christianity.
I am not a fan of Buddhadasa and I have not read his teaching.
Hell was OK, until some wise guy went to heaven and came back
Yes, I came to think that most probable the translations are not totally faithful to what he actually expressed sometimes (which is understandable). I can't remember what was that which I didn't agree about its Santikharo bhikkhu's interpretation of something. I think it was "good and bad" which I bet ajhan Buddhadasa meant "good and bad for me" or similar and not in the way of wholesome and unwholesome, etc.